PW405's Soil Tests - Summer'17

[PW405]

The cycle timing is for Urea and Lime, not SOP and Lime. And two weeks is enough if the Lime is a good Lime.

Oh.... close one! Glad I asked. I almost dropped lime and urea this weekend but decided to go with SOP at the last minute due to difficulties in measuring the amount of required lime (need a scale with higher capacity).

What characteristics does one look for when identifying a quality lime?

[andy10917]

The best three I know are Encap, Jonathan Green's Mag-I-Cal and Sol-U-Cal. All use a humate component.

[PW405]

The best three I know are Encap, Jonathan Green's Mag-I-Cal and Sol-U-Cal. All use a humate component.

I'll have to look for one of those. This is the only calcitic lime I could find locally... before I knew Simplot was so close. Would be interested to get your thoughts. I hear you're in to this sort of thing:



This is the product:
http://www.kellysgreenteam.com/capsulat ... e-pellets/

[TimmyG]

See here and here.

[PW405]

See here and here.

Thanks for the info @TimmyG. I figure I'll go ahead and use this bag and then get something better in the spring. Question though... since I'm doing weekly apps of Urea, you think that it would be OK to apply the lime after "The Pause". Since Andy said to apply during the growing season, the only upcoming chance I'll have to apply the lime is going to be after the weekly urea apps stop, but before the winterizer application. Is this even the growing season? These timelines are all very blurry in this part of the country since fescue seems to go through multiple top growth cessations between November and March.

[ken-n-nancy]

... would be OK to apply the lime after "The Pause". Since Andy said to apply during the growing season, the only upcoming chance I'll have to apply the lime is going to be after the weekly urea apps stop, but before the winterizer application.

From what I understand, the middle of "The Pause" (about 2 weeks after the last urea app pre-pause, and surely at least 2 weeks before the winterizer, as "The Pause" will be at least 4 weeks long and quite possibly 6+ weeks depending upon when the grass does stop growing) would be an excellent time to make a lime application.

[PW405]

From what I understand, the middle of "The Pause" (about 2 weeks after the last urea app pre-pause, and surely at least 2 weeks before the winterizer, as "The Pause" will be at least 4 weeks long and quite possibly 6+ weeks depending upon when the grass does stop growing) would be an excellent time to make a lime application.

Ok, that makes sense. Thanks K&N!

I understand that organic fertilizers are made usable to plants due to the microorganisms helping to break them down, and this is less likely once soil temps drop below a certain point. With Lime though, I'm a little confused about why applying during the growing season is suggested. I figured since it was an inorganic substance, microherd doesn't perform any conversion.

[andy10917]

There is no conversion. But we don't recommend the application of anything (organic or inorganic) when the ground is frozen, lacks rainfall, etc. It doesn't go into the soil in those conditions and is prone to being washed away or leached away.

[ken-n-nancy]

... With Lime though, I'm a little confused about why applying during the growing season is suggested. ...

That's probably a bit of a cool-season lawn assumption that if it's not the growing season, it's because the ground is frozen! (Very true where I live in New Hampshire!)

Basically, you don't want to apply lime or any other sorts of soil amendments to the lawn when the ground is frozen, as whatever is applied is likely to wash away during snow-melt or during early spring rains on mostly-frozen ground.

If the ground is still not frozen, and won't be for at least long enough for whatever is applied to be washed down into the soil, then go for it!

[PW405]

That's probably a bit of a cool-season lawn assumption that if it's not the growing season, it's because the ground is frozen! (Very true where I live in New Hampshire!)

Basically, you don't want to apply lime or any other sorts of soil amendments to the lawn when the ground is frozen, as whatever is applied is likely to wash away during snow-melt or during early spring rains on mostly-frozen ground.

If the ground is still not frozen, and won't be for at least long enough for whatever is applied to be washed down into the soil, then go for it!

Ahh, gotcha. You northerners and your "frozen soil". Why can't you be like us Okies and have a normal autumn where the upper-atmosphere is above freezing, while the lower atmosphere is freezing?

Time release rain! Soaks into the soil over 2-5 days:

[andy10917]

Why can't you be like us Okies and have a normal autumn where the upper-atmosphere is above freezing, while the lower atmosphere is freezing?

We get it big-time during Nor'easter season.

It sucks, big time. Hearing hundreds of acres of 100-yr old trees breaking and crashing to the ground breaks my heart, (although HLG says I don't have a heart).

[PW405]

From what I understand, the middle of "The Pause" (about 2 weeks after the last urea app pre-pause, and surely at least 2 weeks before the winterizer, as "The Pause" will be at least 4 weeks long and quite possibly 6+ weeks depending upon when the grass does stop growing) would be an excellent time to make a lime application.

I'm planning to do my lime application this weekend. Grass still growing, albeit a bit slower than the past few weeks. I wanted to get some opinions on my plan:

I'm pursing the aggressive fall nitrogen regimen and currently in "The Pause". I also need to make my second application of micro nutrients per my soil test instructions. Instead of using milorganite as the "vehicle", I was wondering if anybody has ever used lime as the vehicle to apply micronutrients? I didn't want to add the N that will come along with the Milorganite, so I figured if I'm going to make an application of lime, why not piggyback on that and also get my micro's put down?

[TimmyG]

You do not want to get lime wet. You do not. That's why not.

[PW405]

You do not want to get lime wet. You do not. That's why not.

Hmm, well.. fiddlesticks. Any others ideas for a material I could use as a micronutrient application vehicle? Should I just wait until spring? I was thinking I could use Scott's Every Drop, a granular wetting agent. Need to order a new bag though. Technically not sold in my state, but Amazon will ship it to you.

https://www.amazon.com/Scotts-Every-Gra ... every+drop

[ken-n-nancy]

You do not want to get lime wet. You do not. That's why not.

In general, I agree with TimmyG on most everything he posts. You definitely don't want to get powdered limes wet -- they'll clump together and be unspreadable. But some of the newer "quick" calcitic lime products are pelletized. I've been using the Lowes-brand Sta-Green lime the last few years -- it was pelletized and seemed to me that it would have accepted misting and mixing with micronutrients. (However, I didn't try it, so I don't know for sure.)

Is there a chemical-reaction sort of reason that one doesn't want the lime to get misted when applying?

[TimmyG]

I don't even dare spread fast-acting calcitic lime if my grass still has dew. The water droplets kick up onto the impeller and the lime slowly cakes on and becomes rock hard. Obviously, getting powdered lime wet would be a nightmare. In my experience, pelletized lime breaks down quickly upon getting wet and becomes a sticky mess. (That includes Sta-Green Rapid Lime, my go-to.)

But by all means, experiment for yourself, PW405. Maybe fresh misting with no dawdling will work for you. But don't be surprised if it bridges almost immediately.

[ken-n-nancy]

I don't even dare spread fast-acting calcitic lime if my grass still has dew. The water droplets kick up onto the impeller and the lime slowly cakes on and becomes rock hard. ...

That's helpful info -- I wouldn't have guessed that. Thanks for sharing!

[PW405]

Andy/ST6 team - due to some various delays with "life", I'm a little behind on applying Lime. (Only 1 application this spring).

I've stayed on top of my Milo+Micro's and SOP applications. I was considering waiting to take the soil sample until the start of September so that I'd have time to apply everything suggested as result of my first test. Do you think I should wait until then or go ahead and take sample now?

(By Sept 1, I will have applied my 4th Milo+Micro's, 1 more SOP application, and 1 more Lime application. )

[andy10917]

Don't take a sample after applying Lime. Take it first.