llO0DQLE's 2017 Soil Tests

[llO0DQLE]

Hello team, new lawn here, first soil test. I did front and back because I had no idea what the soil is like. You guys know me, I'll do everything it takes to get it optimal. So, yes, micros please. I haven't measured the yard yet but I can do my own calculations. The pH sucks but the OM is pretty nice. I don't know if the sodium level is high but the previous owner told me that he was using softened water to water the lawn (connected to underground sprinkler system) for the past year or two. Other than that, I have no idea what the management was. Soil color and texture was similar to my last lawn. Grass is KBG and CRF and is growing everywhere so at least the soil seems to support grass, albeit it's not very thick right now but that's partly because the previous owner moved about 7 mos. before I bought the place so it's most likely been neglected. Some areas are quite thin as well. Weed pressure is low. A few dandelions here and there are some areas with a few grassy weeds, probably Johnson Grass or some barnyard grass if I'm guessing right. I plan to reno next year.



Some pics of the lawn

[llO0DQLE]

Link of this thread has been added to the queue. Thanks in advance!

[andy10917]

First things first - there is no need to test or treat these soils differently.

The soil is heavy and has a large amount of OM. That's all good if it drains well. The cations are holding lots of Calcium and Magnesium, but I don't think the soil is calcareous. The pH is the result, at 7.3.

I'm looking for a word to describe the Phosphorus and Potassium levels. Let's try "sucks". Does "Sucks" work for you? We'll keep the early, rough work simple and use balanced fertilizers for the heavy lifting. Find and post a fertilizer like 10-10-10 or 19-19-19. We'll work with what you find.

The Iron numbers are very nice, but probably not very available at pH 7.3. You may want to play with foliar FAS if you are a color freak.

In the micro’s, it’s Boron, Copper and Zinc. Get Twenty Mule Team Laundry Soap (grocery), Copper Sulfate (Amazon/EBay), and Zinc Sulfate (Amazon/Ebay) and apply each at three tablespoons/K every 60 days. Read the Micronutrient Application Guide for application specifics.

Overall, I think you'll like this soil with time and effort.

[llO0DQLE]

Yeah I kinda figured I wouldn't need to test them separately in the future, the results seemed pretty similar. Lol yeah "sucks" works for me. Good to know how long of a road ahead of me I have to take to get it to where it needs to be. And yes, the soil doesn't drain that well. I'll be doing aggressive BLSC/KH. I have spray heads on a couple of zones and it's too much too fast for those zones and it pools pretty quickly. On the zones with rotors or if I use an oscillating hose end sprinkler it does fine though.

I'm pretty sure I can get 10-10-10, it's all I could find in the previous years. Are we applying 1lb of nutrient per K monthly granting it's not too hot this summer? So 10lbs of 10-10-10 per K per app?

I haven't needed to put down multiple micros in the past. Can I mix all of these in one batch? Just wondering how well these specific ingredients stick together with Milo. I'm sure glad I stocked up on Milo when I found out they were discontinued last year. I should have enough bags for micro apps this year but may not have enough for next year. When I run out of Milo, can I use a sprayer and then water it in? Also, how far should I space 10-10-10 and milo/micro apps? 1 week good enough or should I do 2 weeks?

One last thing, can you comment on the sodium and soft water being used for irrigation? I guess the sodium level is fine since you didn't say anything about it. If that's the case, does it not add that much sodium when irrigating with soft water? Or maybe the previous owner was just not watering that much? I can bypass the water softener when turning on the irrigation system. Is that recommended or does it not matter either way?

[andy10917]

Let's start with the Sodium. I worry when the Base Saturation is 2% or higher and panic at about 2.75%. You're at levels of what - 0.41% and 0.56%? Please. You're not even keeping me from yawning.

I wouldn't apply micro's with a sprayer - that amounts to a foliar application. The amounts would be much smaller. Try attaching it to something else -- figure it out.

Thumbs up on the 10 lbs for 10-10-10. If we didn't apply in Summer, what else would we have in Edmonton? Into the snowdrifts?

[llO0DQLE]

Hahaha yeah no kidding. I get two weeks of summer and the rest is winter.

Ok thanks for the reference range on the sodium. I won't worry too much about bypassing the softener. We'll see what next year's test says.

Regarding applying micros with a sprayer, I did mention washing it in after, ie turning on my sprinklers to water maybe 0.25". Still a no go?

[SNOWBOB11]

Hey llo0DQLE, when andy interpreted my soil test I needed work on my micros as well. I followed the micro nutrition application guide but used the triple 16 fertilizer andy recommended I apply, mixed together and it worked fine. I think if you follow the instructions but use your balanced fertilizer it will work fine as well.

[andy10917]

+1 Snowy

[llO0DQLE]

Ok, I'll try that. Thanks Bob.

Andy, thank you for your time and help. Much appreciated as always.

[andy10917]

Hahaha yeah no kidding. I get two weeks of summer and the rest is winter.

I was in Buffalo last week, and we were walking through the parking lot on a raw, drizzly 60 degree day. One of the new members of my team was complaining, and I responded with "WHAT?! This is Buffalo Summer!! It doesn't get better than this!! In another 6-8 weeks, it will be snowing again!!". He actually believed me, and I had to clue him in...

[llO0DQLE]

Bwahaha

[llO0DQLE]

I was able to source SOP 0-0-50 and TSP 0-45-0 which would cost me exactly the same as the 8-8-8 I was going to use. Any concerns if I just went with SOP and TSP instead? I thought I could simplify it by not having to worry about N but wasn't sure if there were any considerations with P and K other than the increases risk of snow mold with K if applied in late fall. Otherwise, same dose of 1lb of nutrient per K 1000 Sq ft monthly? Can I do 1.25 lb of P per month with TSP, ie 2.8 lbs of TSP per 1000 Sq ft, just so I can use them both up at the same time? I'm not to worried about the existing grass if the risk of shocking them is not that big with this rate as I'm going to reno next year anyway. Unless it's just not a good idea to do so then I'll just save the rest for next year.

[llO0DQLE]

Also, most places in the US that sell copper and zinc don't ship to Canada (Amazon.com and most Ebay sellers) otherwise the shipping is double or triple the cost of the product. I did find this locally and was wondering if this was okay to use. It's wettable powder, not sure if that's the same as regular copper sulfate powder.

[andy10917]

In the P and K, that's actually my preferred sources but more work. Not following your math though...

Too much work on the Copper. "Bordo" is probably a brand name of Bordeaux Mix, which is a Copper and Lime combo used as a cheap fungicide. How much Copper? How much Lime? I dunno, and I'm not gonna make my brain hurt.

[llO0DQLE]

Glad I asked about the copper. I asked if they had copper sulfate, she said yes and sent me that pic. I'll just suck up the expensive shipping cost.

For SOP 0-0-50, to apply 1lb of potassium per 1000 Sq ft, app rate is 2lbs of SOP per 1000 Sq feet right?

And for the TSP 0-45-0, it's 2.22lb of of TSP to apply 1lb of phosphorus. I was wondering if it's ok to apply at higher rate of 2.8lbs TSP per 1000 Sq ft to deliver 1.25lbs of phosphorus per app.

[llO0DQLE]

Actually it's the SOP that I wanted to apply at a heavier rate so as to use it up at the same time as the TSP since they both come in 2kg boxes. So my thought was to apply at 2.5lbs of SOP/K to deliver 1.25lbs of potassium per app.

[andy10917]

I don't recommend or test rates above 1 lb/K of the intended nutrient. Ever. I can always find an idiot that says it worked for them. Idiots that got burned never post and fess up to being idiots. Interpret what you will from that, Good luck.

[llO0DQLE]

Lol ok gotcha. I fully intended on disclosing any harm experienced if I went above 1lb/K but since you don't recommend it at all I'll stay within guidelines. Thanks.

[andy10917]

It wasn't aimed at you. The truth is that results on forums are lopsided toward success, because few admit to overstepping their experience level. Always read any forum with that consideration.

[llO0DQLE]

Yeah I know it wasn't. Just saying that I have no qualms to fessing up to be an idiot. Just like how i fessed up in your 2016 lessons thread to being an idiot with doing 2x bag rate milo in the spring of a new reno with no proactive biofungicide program and ending up with fungus. I did mention a few posts above that I knew it's probably risky but was willing to take the risk as I will be doing a reno next year anyway.