Rich G Soil Test

Learn how improving your soil can lead to a better looking lawn
reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » September 27th, 2017, 11:37 am

Here is the Logan Lab results for my front and back yard (not a huge difference but have lots of pine trees in the back so I tested separately).

I am in Southern NH and have a mix of KBG, TTTF and some PR. I have had issues with brown patch and rust in the past.

Overall my lawn looked great this year and I just overseeded with brown patch resistant TTTF from United Seed.

I put a ton of dolomite lime this spring based on my soil test last fall but looks like it is a little low still but not as bad as the calcium.

Looking for recommendations for lime and fert application. I am thinking of trying Milo next year as well as the Lesco I use.

Thanks in advance!

Image

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by andy10917 » September 27th, 2017, 2:33 pm

Make sure to put a link to your test into the Soil Test Interpretation Queue.

reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » September 27th, 2017, 2:42 pm

andy10917 wrote:
September 27th, 2017, 2:33 pm
Make sure to put a link to your test into the Soil Test Interpretation Queue.
Already done :)

reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » September 27th, 2017, 3:47 pm

Also I have around a 9,000 sq ft yard.

reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » September 28th, 2017, 10:25 am

For reference here is the soil test I had done in the fall (it was Lesco not Logan) but will be good for comparison I think.

Surprised that the capacity dropped so much.....
Image

Image


reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » October 3rd, 2017, 2:44 pm

Any chance someone can take a look at this was hoping to figure out what to put down for lime this fall and start planning my regime for next year

Thanks in advance!

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by andy10917 » October 8th, 2017, 10:12 am

I have no idea what the pine trees have to do with this, but whatever...

The soil is sandy but has OK OM numbers - more OM would help boost the TEC though. Keep it coming.

In the cations, you have either stay with the dolomitic at bag rates and schedule or switch to calcitic + epsom salts, which may speed things up. Let me know if you want to switch.

Since the Phosphorus is actually high, we need to boost the Potassium individually - get Sulfate of Potash (SOP, 0-0-50) and apply April to September, monthly at 2 lbs/K. Go ahead and use the Milorganite with that as the budget allows.

Iron numbers are fine.

In the micro’s, it’s Boron and Copper. Get Twenty Mule Team Laundry Soap (grocery) and Copper Sulfate (Amazon/EBay), and apply each at three tablespoons/K every 60 days. Read the Micronutrient Application Guide for application specifics.

reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » October 8th, 2017, 12:45 pm

andy10917 wrote:
October 8th, 2017, 10:12 am
I have no idea what the pine trees have to do with this, but whatever...

The soil is sandy but has OK OM numbers - more OM would help boost the TEC though. Keep it coming.

In the cations, you have either stay with the dolomitic at bag rates and schedule or switch to calcitic + epsom salts, which may speed things up. Let me know if you want to switch.

Since the Phosphorus is actually high, we need to boost the Potassium individually - get Sulfate of Potash (SOP, 0-0-50) and apply April to September, monthly at 2 lbs/K. Go ahead and use the Milorganite with that as the budget allows.

Iron numbers are fine.

In the micro’s, it’s Boron and Copper. Get Twenty Mule Team Laundry Soap (grocery) and Copper Sulfate (Amazon/EBay), and apply each at three tablespoons/K every 60 days. Read the Micronutrient Application Guide for application specifics.
Thanks Andy much appreciated.

I was always under the impression that pine trees and their needles causes more acidic soils.

With the Dolomitic lime will it increase my calcium enough? What does the calcitic and Epsom salts do and what will it speed up?

Can I apply the SOP with my last winter fert? Or wait til April. And can I apply that with my normal fertilizer or should I change that as well?

Will look up the micronutrients info on the site. Seems hard to apply that little amount to my whole yard but will read up on it.

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by andy10917 » October 8th, 2017, 1:20 pm

I was always under the impression that pine trees and their needles causes more acidic soils.
You were under the wrong impression then. Old wife's tale - stop listening to old wives (unless they're hot).
With the Dolomitic lime will it increase my calcium enough?
Of course it will, but it will be pushing the Magnesium up too - at the ratio of whatever product you buy.
What does the calcitic and Epsom salts do and what will it speed up?
Calcitic lime lacks the Magnesium. Now we can add it from Epsom Salts (Magnesium Sulfate) at the rate WE want to add it. That's flexibility. Also, top-quality Calcitic Limes (Mag-I-Cal/Sol-U-Cal/Encap) work into the soil in 5-8 weeks, while cheap dolomitic lime can take 12-14 MONTHS. That means more applications in less time and quicker results.
Can I apply the SOP with my last winter fert? Or wait til April.
Wait until April.
And can I apply that with my normal fertilizer or should I change that as well?
Not enough detail to answer.
Will look up the micronutrients info on the site. Seems hard to apply that little amount to my whole yard but will read up on it.
The article is already written - it's the Micronutrient Application Guide.

reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » October 8th, 2017, 1:30 pm

andy10917 wrote:
October 8th, 2017, 1:20 pm

Calcitic lime lacks the Magnesium. Now we can add it from Epsom Salts (Magnesium Sulfate) at the rate WE want to add it. That's flexibility. Also, top-quality Calcitic Limes (Mag-I-Cal/Sol-U-Cal/Encap) work into the soil in 5-8 weeks, while cheap dolomitic lime can take 12-14 MONTHS. That means more applications in less time and quicker results.


And can I apply that with my normal fertilizer or should I change that as well?
Not enough detail to answer
I assume I can find the rates for the Epsom salts on the site.

To clarify my question on the fertilizer. Can I use the normal spring fertilizer I use with potash already in and the SOP or should I use a fertilizer with 0 Potash and use the SOP in addition. Don't want to add to much Potash.

Thanks Andy!

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by andy10917 » October 8th, 2017, 1:58 pm

I assume I can find the rates for the Epsom salts on the site.
Once/if you decide to go that way (calcitic+), I'll figure it out.
To clarify my question on the fertilizer. Can I use the normal spring fertilizer I use with potash already in and the SOP or should I use a fertilizer with 0 Potash and use the SOP in addition. Don't want to add to much Potash.
Still missing the important info -- what is the NPK or amount of Potassium/Potash in your "normal" fertilizer, and what is your application rate?

reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » October 11th, 2017, 10:21 pm

andy10917 wrote:
October 8th, 2017, 1:58 pm
I assume I can find the rates for the Epsom salts on the site.
Once/if you decide to go that way (calcitic+), I'll figure it out.
To clarify my question on the fertilizer. Can I use the normal spring fertilizer I use with potash already in and the SOP or should I use a fertilizer with 0 Potash and use the SOP in addition. Don't want to add to much Potash.
Still missing the important info -- what is the NPK or amount of Potassium/Potash in your "normal" fertilizer, and what is your application rate?
Andy I like the idea of using the calcitic to get quicker results and know that I think back that dolomite lime took forever to break down! Can you send me the mixture you recommend and the frequency?

In regards to my fertlizer I used the below this year. Looks like I could use more of the P!

First app - 19-0-6 Lesco Dimension 50# bag over 9k sg ft (so a little heavy, the bag does up to 12k sq ft)
Second app - 18-0-4 Lesco Lock up 50# bag over 9k sg ft (so a little heavy, the bag does up to 12k sq ft)
Third App - 20-0-5
Fourth App - 18-24-12 Lesco Starter Fertilzer for over seed
I plan on using 21-0-21 for my winter fertilzer

Lastly how often do you recommend applying the milo and do you apply per the bag instructions as far as #/sq ft?

I appreciate the help!

TimmyG
Posts: 2244
Joined: May 15th, 2012, 6:04 pm
Location: Dracut, MA
Grass Type: Northern Mix
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Experienced

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by TimmyG » October 12th, 2017, 12:45 am

reggie517 wrote:
October 11th, 2017, 10:21 pm
I plan on using 21-0-21 for my winter fertilzer
Be aware:
andy10917 wrote:
September 23rd, 2017, 8:52 am
Potassium apps in the late season are not recommended - there is some test evidence that it can increase Snow Mold damage in the late Winter/Spring. As there is plenty of time to get it down at other times, why roll the dice?

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by andy10917 » October 12th, 2017, 10:51 pm

put back into the Queue - too late to start tonight

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by andy10917 » October 13th, 2017, 8:32 am

This is sort of why I don't care for late season soil tests - too many contradictions...

Don't apply late-season Potassium - there are some tests that indicate that it can increase Snow Mold. Do the Potassium in the Spring and Summer.

Read the Fall Nitrogen Regimens and pick one to finish the year. The challenge is that Urea and Lime don't go down at the same time - a good chunk of the Urea is lost.

Starting in the Spring, apply 10 lbs/K of good calcitic Lime (Mag-I-Cal/Encap/Sol-U-Cal) mixed with 2 lbs/K of Epsom Salts. Apply at 12 lbs/K every 90 days.

reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » October 15th, 2017, 9:06 am

andy10917 wrote:
October 13th, 2017, 8:32 am
This is sort of why I don't care for late season soil tests - too many contradictions...

Don't apply late-season Potassium - there are some tests that indicate that it can increase Snow Mold. Do the Potassium in the Spring and Summer.

Read the Fall Nitrogen Regimens and pick one to finish the year. The challenge is that Urea and Lime don't go down at the same time - a good chunk of the Urea is lost.

Starting in the Spring, apply 10 lbs/K of good calcitic Lime (Mag-I-Cal/Encap/Sol-U-Cal) mixed with 2 lbs/K of Epsom Salts. Apply at 12 lbs/K every 90 days.
Thanks again Andy it is greatly appreciated. So it should like I should wait til the spring to add the lime correct? It could I apply the lines now and wait a month and apply the last app of fertilizer?

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by andy10917 » October 15th, 2017, 10:16 am

I would wait on the Lime - the moment to put the winterizer down is pretty short (when growth stops). If the lime had gone down recently, that would be an issue.

reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » October 15th, 2017, 11:21 am

andy10917 wrote:
October 15th, 2017, 10:16 am
I would wait on the Lime - the moment to put the winterizer down is pretty short (when growth stops). If the lime had gone down recently, that would be an issue.
So how do I go about it in the spring won't I run into the same issue? Should I toss the lime down before the first spring app of fertilizer?

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by andy10917 » October 15th, 2017, 11:31 am

C'mon - put on the thinking cap. The Lime goes on a 90-day cycle, with a two-week spacing from anything containing urea-based Nitrogen. The Nitrogen will be on a 30-day cycle. It's easy to keep them away from each other.

Your issue this Fall is that you don't have even two weeks left certain. I imagine that the date for average first frost is past and that you should be in The Pause now. That indicated that you're probably less than 30 days from stoppage of growth and playing with both Urea and Lime is not advised.

reggie517
Posts: 273
Joined: July 14th, 2015, 11:37 am
Location: Merrimack NH
Grass Type: TTTF/KBG
Lawn Size: 5000-10000
Level: Some Experience

Re: Rich G Soil Test

Post by reggie517 » October 15th, 2017, 11:38 am

andy10917 wrote:
October 15th, 2017, 11:31 am
C'mon - put on the thinking cap. The Lime goes on a 90-day cycle, with a two-week spacing from anything containing urea-based Nitrogen. The Nitrogen will be on a 30-day cycle. It's easy to keep them away from each other.

Your issue this Fall is that you don't have even two weeks left certain. I imagine that the date for average first frost is past and that you should be in The Pause now. That indicated that you're probably less than 30 days from stoppage of growth and playing with both Urea and Lime is not advised.
It has been unseasonable warm up here this fall and we have not had a first frost yet and the grass is still growing. I will wait to the spring and start the lime. I wasn't aware of the two week gap. Still learning all this stuff. Do you start with the nitrogen or the lime or does it not matter?

Thanks again.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests