Dry Spot Experiment

Learn how improving your soil can lead to a better looking lawn
User avatar
NiciPicki
Posts: 1494
Joined: April 6th, 2012, 1:15 pm
Location: Columbus, OH
Grass Type: Elite KBG: Award, Moonbeam, Prosperity
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by NiciPicki » July 3rd, 2012, 5:46 pm

I did use the hose end sprayer. I'm sure from the neighbor's driveway it looked like I was standing there watering the lawn with the hose after the storm.

[ Post made via Android ] Image

User avatar
MorpheusPA
Posts: 18129
Joined: March 5th, 2009, 7:32 pm
Location: Zone 6 (Eastern PA)
Grass Type: Elite KBG
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Advanced

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by MorpheusPA » July 3rd, 2012, 5:56 pm

NiciPicki wrote:I used 112 ounces over 7.5k, all told. The back yard was really fast because that was the light app. The front yard is when I began wondering if the neighbor is right, and maybe I really am crazy.
You crazy, gurrrl. :-) Yes, it's fantastically tedious--it took me about 1.5 hours to do 10 K and it's pretty boring...

User avatar
bernstem
Posts: 4232
Joined: April 15th, 2011, 2:59 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO
Grass Type: Front: Solar Eclipse/Award/Bewitched/Moonlight SLT/Prosperity Back: Solar Eclipse Monostand + Bewitched (shade)
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by bernstem » July 3rd, 2012, 6:30 pm

A heavy dose of soil conditioner is on my list for tomorrow. It definitely seems to help in the heat. The lawn needs water, so I'll get up early, apply the soap and then water it in. I did top dress the front with 200lbs of compost and 4 bales of peat moss on Sunday which seems to have helped with surviving the heat.

User avatar
MorpheusPA
Posts: 18129
Joined: March 5th, 2009, 7:32 pm
Location: Zone 6 (Eastern PA)
Grass Type: Elite KBG
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Advanced

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by MorpheusPA » July 3rd, 2012, 8:26 pm

The dry spots are performing so beautifully (they look fantastic in really awful weather) that I expanded the experiment again. To the whole lawn, but at a lower rate.

I've sprayed 22 ounces per thousand Xtra laundry detergent over the entire thing (I could get that cheap and I found one with no boron [or other whiteners] in it). 150+ ounces of Xtra is $6 at my grocery store, ultra-concentrated, and doesn't require re-mixing gallons of conditioner, a requirement for today as I was short on time. I filled in with Dawn by mixing 10 ounces into each sprayer load with some water to thin the solution.

The lawn was actually improving behind my spray--the very soapy water clung to the grass blades and they regained their green color in an hour. I irrigated for ten minutes per zone behind myself to dilute it down and push it to the soil, and I'm doing a full irrigation now to prep for the evening of the Fourth (which includes plenty of small neighborhood fireworks I'd rather not start a grass fire).

HanLawn
Posts: 3226
Joined: March 6th, 2011, 7:27 pm
Location: frederick,maryland
Grass Type: COCHISE IV,FALCON V,FAITH TTTF + KBG
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by HanLawn » July 3rd, 2012, 8:43 pm

Does that much soap send the worms scrambling?


User avatar
MorpheusPA
Posts: 18129
Joined: March 5th, 2009, 7:32 pm
Location: Zone 6 (Eastern PA)
Grass Type: Elite KBG
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Advanced

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by MorpheusPA » July 3rd, 2012, 8:52 pm

HanLawn wrote:Does that much soap send the worms scrambling?
They don't seem to notice.

Actually, if you do the math, that's 0.022 ounces per square foot, diluted initially in the hose end and then irrigated with 0.6 gallons of water. 0.022 ounces in 77 ounces of water is a 0.03% solution all told.

You could drink that and never know there was soap in it. Maybe a slight aftertaste, but it wouldn't make you feel at all ill even if you downed a gallon of it.

HanLawn
Posts: 3226
Joined: March 6th, 2011, 7:27 pm
Location: frederick,maryland
Grass Type: COCHISE IV,FALCON V,FAITH TTTF + KBG
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by HanLawn » July 3rd, 2012, 9:39 pm

I ask, because in the Spring,after every rain, I saw dozens of worms craw onto the patio....now? None.

I wonder if the shampoo is contributing to that, or maybe they dont like the acidic peatmoss topdressing,or whether it is something else? Where did they go? I have used zero insecticides,fungicides,etc. Just one app of Dimension way back in mid March,2 drops of horse pellets,and 1 app of Milorganite along with the micros and P & K additions so far this entire year.

User avatar
Joe'sCentipede
Posts: 366
Joined: December 5th, 2011, 4:54 pm
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Grass Type: Prestige Buffalo Grass
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by Joe'sCentipede » July 3rd, 2012, 10:08 pm

HanLawn wrote:I ask, because in the Spring,after every rain, I saw dozens of worms craw onto the patio....now? None.

I wonder if the shampoo is contributing to that, or maybe they dont like the acidic peatmoss topdressing,or whether it is something else? Where did they go? I have used zero insecticides,fungicides,etc. Just one app of Dimension way back in mid March,2 drops of horse pellets,and 1 app of Milorganite along with the micros and P & K additions so far this entire year.
Have you not encountered them while digging in the soil? If your soil's draining better now, they may not have flooded burrows to crawl out of.

HanLawn
Posts: 3226
Joined: March 6th, 2011, 7:27 pm
Location: frederick,maryland
Grass Type: COCHISE IV,FALCON V,FAITH TTTF + KBG
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by HanLawn » July 3rd, 2012, 10:38 pm

I have not dug into the soil at all.

User avatar
MorpheusPA
Posts: 18129
Joined: March 5th, 2009, 7:32 pm
Location: Zone 6 (Eastern PA)
Grass Type: Elite KBG
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Advanced

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by MorpheusPA » July 4th, 2012, 6:39 am

+1 Joe. Mine used to be all over the driveway and patio during rains. Now, not so much. There are still worms choosing to travel and find new homes during rains, but not the numbers I saw before.

Digging in the garden is an exercise in moving worms, so it's not a population shortage (if anything, populations are extremely large). It's just that the burrows don't flood and the worms don't have to head for high ground any longer.

Ohio2112
Posts: 1188
Joined: August 28th, 2009, 1:00 am
Location: Northeast Ohio
Grass Type: KBG
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by Ohio2112 » July 4th, 2012, 6:03 pm

Why did you choose not to use SLS & yucca for the experiment?

[ Post made via iPhone ] Image

User avatar
MorpheusPA
Posts: 18129
Joined: March 5th, 2009, 7:32 pm
Location: Zone 6 (Eastern PA)
Grass Type: Elite KBG
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Advanced

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by MorpheusPA » July 4th, 2012, 8:05 pm

It started that I had the Dawn with me when washing the windows. Which then led to being short of time on Tuesday and just grabbing some Xtra detergent to do it. So no reason, really, just a series of accidents.

mattya
Posts: 4179
Joined: May 22nd, 2012, 9:24 am
Location: Southeast MA
Grass Type: Bewitched, Prosperity, Moonlight SLT
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by mattya » July 5th, 2012, 12:32 am

Any reason you didn't put down Kelp Help also? I got some trouble areas too that I hit today with a heavy (not nearly as heavy as yours) dose of Kelp and Shampoo. It'll get hit again hard(er) in 2 weeks also, just wondering if I should do just shampoo or keep up with heavy-ish Kelp.

User avatar
MorpheusPA
Posts: 18129
Joined: March 5th, 2009, 7:32 pm
Location: Zone 6 (Eastern PA)
Grass Type: Elite KBG
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Advanced

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by MorpheusPA » July 5th, 2012, 4:33 am

I dropped Kelp Help on the first of July across the entire lawn, actually, at a fairly heavy rate. It's great stuff, I love it, but it doesn't have much effect on dry spot or stressed areas of the lawn--not at any great rate of speed, anyway!

IS4AU
Posts: 218
Joined: April 27th, 2012, 6:40 pm
Location: Alabama
Grass Type: Bermuda
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by IS4AU » July 5th, 2012, 5:53 pm

Hey morph, would you recommend this on Bermuda lawns if so what app would you do it at. Its getting hot here almost 100 everyday. Got some dry spots around pine trees.

[ Post made via Android ] Image

User avatar
MorpheusPA
Posts: 18129
Joined: March 5th, 2009, 7:32 pm
Location: Zone 6 (Eastern PA)
Grass Type: Elite KBG
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Advanced

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by MorpheusPA » July 5th, 2012, 6:18 pm

I dunno. I can't imagine that Bermuda is that much different than KBG, although your temperatures are warmer (today was 94, tomorrow 99). Perhaps try one test spot first?

User avatar
GeorgiaDad
Posts: 2163
Joined: July 13th, 2011, 2:32 pm
Location: Suwanee, Ga.
Grass Type: Frontyard: Award, NuChicago, Midnight. kbg Backyard: Mutt Fescue with a little Midnight kbg thrown in.
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by GeorgiaDad » July 6th, 2012, 4:13 pm

Picked up 160lbs of the equestrian horse pellets. Dropped them over 5.5/k of grass. I went a little lighter in the shade that looks good. A little heavier in the harder hit areas. I am hoping it rains tonight so I don't have to water in. Debating on whether to spray the Dawn late this afternoon or wait til Monday. Will be too busy next 2 days.

I went by the local woodshop. They do not deal in anything treated. But the draw back was he said the sawdust was 50-50 hardwood/softwood. So off to Tractor Supply. Found the horse pellets. I think I made the right choice. Pellets were easy to spread vs. sawdust.

I had my 16yr old son help me spread the pellets. We were walking the yard talking and he asked what this was supposed to do. I explained about the water retention and om. But then he asked what we were spreading. I said Equestrian horse pellets. He stopped, looked at me and said "Who the h*** has the time to figure out all this wacky crap you put down on the lawn? I mean really dad, who thinks hmmm I think I'll spray milk on the lawn and see what it does. Wow that works lets try molasses and shampoo". I just about rolled across the lawn. :rotfl:

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by andy10917 » July 6th, 2012, 4:25 pm

But the draw back was he said the sawdust was 50-50 hardwood/softwood.
Please don't tell me that you walked away from free sawdust. I'd have to travel all the way to Suwanee just to kick you in the a$$.

He stopped, looked at me and said "Who the h*** has the time to figure out all this wacky crap you put down on the lawn?
Me, for one. :club: :club: But not really - some of it is common-sense ("why would I throw this sawdust away?") and then when it worked well, I ran out of sawdust. Most is bumping into other peoples' discoveries. The "milk idea" was from a farmer that dumped milk that he couldn't sell onto his pastureland, and found "hey, the grass grows better there!".

User avatar
MorpheusPA
Posts: 18129
Joined: March 5th, 2009, 7:32 pm
Location: Zone 6 (Eastern PA)
Grass Type: Elite KBG
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Advanced

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by MorpheusPA » July 6th, 2012, 8:11 pm

GeorgiaDad wrote:Picked up 160lbs of the equestrian horse pellets. Dropped them over 5.5/k of grass. I went a little lighter in the shade that looks good. A little heavier in the harder hit areas. I am hoping it rains tonight so I don't have to water in. Debating on whether to spray the Dawn late this afternoon or wait til Monday. Will be too busy next 2 days.
Good rate--as of today that's about half total what I dropped, a quarter my rate on the south face, and a twentieth the rate of my problem areas.

Yes, for those of you doing the math, that's about eight hundred pounds of sawdust. The last load down was pretty heavy, and it looks like millions of rabbits with digestive issues came and had a poo.

My mother stopped by and the first comment out of her mouth was, "Why is your lawn so green? Are you watering daily or something?" Um, no. She's heading to Tractor Supply tomorrow.
I went by the local woodshop. They do not deal in anything treated. But the draw back was he said the sawdust was 50-50 hardwood/softwood. So off to Tractor Supply. Found the horse pellets. I think I made the right choice. Pellets were easy to spread vs. sawdust.
+1 Andy. Hardwood is absolutely fine, it'll just be a little slower to break down. That's not a significant issue and may actually be helpful for you as Georgia summers are much longer and hotter than Pennsylvania ones!

Don't turn down free, untreated sawdust.
I had my 16yr old son help me spread the pellets. We were walking the yard talking and he asked what this was supposed to do. I explained about the water retention and om. But then he asked what we were spreading. I said Equestrian horse pellets. He stopped, looked at me and said "Who the h*** has the time to figure out all this wacky crap you put down on the lawn? I mean really dad, who thinks hmmm I think I'll spray milk on the lawn and see what it does. Wow that works lets try molasses and shampoo". I just about rolled across the lawn. :rotfl:
Keep in mind a lot of this isn't blind experimentation, it's logic and chemistry and physics. It's obvious that mulch forms a barrier against evaporation, and if you think about the types of mulches you can use in the lawn sawdust very quickly rises to the top of the list. So does peat moss, except for that water-refusing thing. Compost is on the list as well, except for the expense, weight, and difficulty spreading it. Sawdust is light for its volume, decays very nicely eventually, and cheap. So simple physics combined with a little logic and bingo.

Molasses....sugar for the microherd. Chemistry gets you the reason that surfactants help out soils.

User avatar
MorpheusPA
Posts: 18129
Joined: March 5th, 2009, 7:32 pm
Location: Zone 6 (Eastern PA)
Grass Type: Elite KBG
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Advanced

Re: Dry Spot Experiment

Post by MorpheusPA » July 6th, 2012, 8:51 pm

And more sawdust over the last two days--to the tune of another 320 pounds for a grand total of about 800 pounds across 9,000 square feet including heavy applications to problem areas in the hopes that they won't be quite so problematic any longer.

Rates are now:

Most areas: 60 per K
Southern face: 120 per K
Modest problem areas: 150-300 per K
Problem areas: 600 per K

Modest problem areas are the ones that go well after the problem areas do, but before the southern face of the main lawn does.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 20 guests