2017 S.E. Mass. Small all KBG Reno...

[northeastlawn]

Same few problem areas, I am not sure I see the grass spreading into the borders here, but its too late to throw down more seed. The multi day watering ends October 1st if fall gets here, maybe Ill look back next spring and these areas will look much different...

[SNOWBOB11]

Don't sound so disappointed, Its looking good. I think it will spread lots over the next few weeks and you have all of next spring for things to really spread. One thing, I'd start dropping urea apps ASAP and not wait until October 1st. I think it's had it's time to S&P, time to get things growing.

[HoosierDaddy]

If you search for my 2016 reno you will see my day 35 pics on page 3. Now I was 100% KBG but the spread was fine and I have total coverage now. I think that bewitched will fill in those spots very nicely.

[northeastlawn]

If you search for my 2016 reno you will see my day 35 pics on page 3. Now I was 100% KBG but the spread was fine and I have total coverage now. I think that bewitched will fill in those spots very nicely.

I haven't change my lawn type as I was waiting for the reno to be successfull before I changed it, but I am 100% KBG. I am equal parts, Bewitched, Prosperity, Midnight, and Blueberry.

Thanks for the reply, Ill look through your thread, and see how it all turned out. It does help seeing where other people have been at the same time in the reno.

[Marinegrunt]

I think it's looking good and you have no reason to be disappointed. I'm 2 weeks behind but went with tttf + 10% kbg so in a way we're probably close for comparison purposes. Yours has turned out a lot thicker than mine. Yours is going to spread much faster too since you went 100% KBG. I too have areas on the side that just didn't want to germinate. The big strip is next to the concrete section of driveway and areas by the patio.

If you're still thin come winter you could always try a little dormant seeding in areas. I have a feeling that if you give it about 3 weeks you'll have a hard time finding a thin spot. The urea apps will make a huge difference. If there are any thin areas going into winter they'll fill right in come spring.

[northeastlawn]

If you're still thin come winter you could always try a little dormant seeding in areas. I have a feeling that if you give it about 3 weeks you'll have a hard time finding a thin spot. The urea apps will make a huge difference. If there are any thin areas going into winter they'll fill right in come spring.

If I plan on dormant seeding, I can't put down a pre-m in the spring. I guess I'd rather take my chances on the KBG spreading and having a good pre-M down.

As it is now the night temps are expected to drop sharply around Thursday. My original plan was to start the Urea at 0.25#/N/K as soon as I get an 1" of rain or on October 1st. The rain doesn't look likely.

Wednesday the night before the temps drop Ill probably put out the Urea and water it in. The grass will be fertilized when Fall finally gets here.

The other big decision was putting down Dimension on October 1st. I didn't seem to have a ton of POA when I did the 2nd Tenacity app, but POA is why i had to kill the old lawn. I still have an unopened bag of granular dimension from 2 years ago.

My original plan was to put it down Oct. 1st. It would be safe to say that 1/2 of the lawn is more than 14 days old and out of S&P, but I know a bunch of it isn't and I'd hate to kill off any grass in my thin areas....

Not sure on putting down the Dimension....

[greenrebellion]

Apply the dimension at the lowest labeled rate and you shouldn't harm any KBG as long as it is 10 days post emerging. At higher rates, 14 days is needed. If you are saying that half your lawn hasn't been out of the ground for more than a couple of days, then hold off another week.

[ken-n-nancy]

If I plan on dormant seeding, I can't put down a pre-m in the spring. I guess I'd rather take my chances on the KBG spreading and having a good pre-M down.

The spring spreading of fertilized KBG is fun to watch. One does need to be careful with it, as spring fertilization can set one up for fungal problems in the summer, but as with many aspects of lawn care, it's a balancing act and depending upon your weather conditions and specific needs in the lawn, different people in different places will have differences in the "right approach."

However, as an example of how KBG can fill in when fertilized in the spring, check the "before" and "after" photos of my spring thread from a few years ago: (better be willing to mow every three days, though!) [No overseeding took place; this is just from spreading and/or possibly from recovery of grass that had no green above ground but still living crowns.]

1 May 2015: (after winter damage)
(click to enlarge)

11 June 2015: (six weeks later)
(click to enlarge)

[northeastlawn]

Apply the dimension at the lowest labeled rate and you shouldn't harm any KBG as long as it is 10 days post emerging. At higher rates, 14 days is needed. If you are saying that half your lawn hasn't been out of the ground for more than a couple of days, then hold off another week.

Actually this Wednesday will make 6 weeks, so everything that germinated @ 4 weeks will have been up for 14 days. The things is I still clearly have some areas still in S&P, meaning the seedlings is still building there roots? That would be the reason to wait it out, but I am not sure if that is how it works.

Then again If I waited for every seedling to get out of S&P and wait 30 days for fertilizer, most of the yard would suffer because I was codling a few thin areas. I can tell the grass is growing quick, because I cut a little more and more every few days I cut it to two inches. It probably starving for some Urea.

I get too hung up on absolutes, I am not sure 4-5 cold nights is going to cause a POA explosion, just as the pre-m isn't 100% to stop the POA that comes up in the spring.

My watering is down to once a day after the 85deg heat we until Wednesday. So the POA won't have the water the KBG was getting. I'll take a chance on Oct. 1st to give any KBG a little more time to get out of S&P.

[northeastlawn]

Thanks for those pictures, it helps me have the faith to be patient. I'm counting on the winterizer Urea app and BSF in the spring to bring its home.

In my past over-seeds my PR,FF, KBG mix never seemed to fill into the thin spots or even just cover the worm castings. I am looking forward to when I no longer have to over-seed every year and can just apply pre-m and do the aggressive fall fertilizer program.

Hopefully ill have some of those cool photos of thin spots fill in nice and thick next June.

[northeastlawn]

Here are some updated pics of the lawn on day 44. Most of the lawn seems to be out of S&P so I cut the 30 day waiting period after germination a little short so I could get 3 weekly fertilizer apps in before the avg. first frost date in my area on October 20th.

I put down 0.25#/N/K of Urea mixed with a little BSF and watered it in. It may be too early for some of the grass that germinated late, but it seems like I need to transition to normal watering and hopefully cutting with the gas mower so I can start mulching leaves in a week or two.

We are getting some decent rain tomorrow and the temps at night are taking a nose dive. I have been mowing more and more every few days now so I am also taking a chance and putting down Dimension Pre-M. I may loose some of the KBG that just popped up, but at some point am I watering for the KBG or POA?

I figure its safer for me to get a pre-m down, then keep pushing for more seed germination.

[ken-n-nancy]

That grass looks hungry to me. I think making the light fertilizer application was exactly the right thing to do. Hopefully these cooler temperatures will help it really take off!

[northeastlawn]

So I am at day 50 and putting down my 2nd fall fertilizer app at the standard 0.25#N/K rate. Its too small amount to spread, so I mix it in with about 5# of BSF.

We have had some pretty warm 70-80deg days and warm nights lately. The lawn still looks better in pictures than in real life, but am cutting it to 2" every few days so it never gets a chance to look like my normal lawn.

Most concerning is some of the grass seems too be turning yellow, especially where the seed ran off into each other and came in too think. The same thing has happened at my previous over-seeds and I always loose the grass there. I applied some serenade at 3oz/k with 2tbsp of Bondi Turbo Sticker, but have a feeling its because the grass isn't getting watered every day like it was before.

Now sure what to do, here are the overall pics....

[northeastlawn]

So here is corner #1, it is starting to fill in, but I never put the Dimension Pre-M here. I put a tarp down to protect the small seedlings still coming up. So I am not quite sure what is coming up here it could be POA.

We have some good rain coming Sunday night. I think its time to cut this section loose and put Dimension down in the spots I avoided last time.

Also check out the yellowing in the dense areas, that is the big concern. Is it disease or just stress from watering it every other day and it still getting into the mid 70's?

I applied Serenade and my 2nd Urea app was watered in this morning.

[northeastlawn]

Here are the problem areas around the borders, I gave them a another week to establish and avoided the borders when I put the Dimension Pre-M down, but with a good rain coming I am thinking its time get that down. I always get a ton of POA here.

[SNOWBOB11]

It’s looking better and more full with each update! Kind of hard to make out the yellow areas in the pic, but there’s a couple small areas in my reno where the grass has turned a bit yellow as well. It’s not fert burn and it kind of looks like a bit of a small fungal issue from some heavier shade and not having the ability to dry out from watering. I’ve applied seranade as well and will probably do so again a couple more times this year. I’m not too worried about them atm.

[northeastlawn]

Its hard to figure out because I also have the clippings for the cuttings in the yard yellowing. Normally those are hidden under the grass. The lawn is so short and thin and doesn't cover them up like a normal lawn.

But I have gotten then at the edges before during over-seeds and they will just whither away and die. I have good watering setup now, I'm going do a few serenade apps and try to keep the borders from drying out. I had hoped to stretch the watering out more, but the warm weather has me thinking twice about it.

Sunday we have a good 0.5"-1" rain on the away, then cooler nights again. Ill wait to see what happens after that.

[HoosierDaddy]

Those areas are going to fill in so fast in the late Spring... PAM. Philes. Alfalfa. Milk. Light, frequent feedings of fert once it's awake. I used alfalfa pellets (~30lbs/k total over 2 apps.) And sprayed milk a few times. Holes filled fast. I had a 3 ft strip around the entire perimeter of my lawn where I had used a hand pump sprayer which must have had some residual product in it. I mean bare. There was no grass in those areas this Spring despite multiple seed attempts last fall. I plugged the areas closest to the house and left the rest. The plugs filled in. The other areas filled in. I had an area that was missing irrigation coverage at a far corner. It didn't fill in very fast. Until it cooled off this fall, adjusted irrigation and few rains, and Aggressive Fall fert. regimen. Now it's full. Yours is going to be great if you keep following the plan!

[northeastlawn]

Thanks, I think its starting to look like a lawn.

The yard is defiantly getting a lot less sun from the different angles in the fall. Ill be doing one more urea app this year, and then winterizing later. Next spring the plan was to doing half bag rate of BSF every other week starting in May.

My big concern is stayed ahead of any fungus issues next year. I have been using serenade every other week, but might have to look into some other preventative stuff next year.

[northeastlawn]

So I am cheating a little bit here and taking these pictures before I cut it and in the morning before the sun shows all its flaws. The middle is filling in nicely, but the borders have a way to go. But it looks really good now and the middle has filled in so much, I am so happy I went with 100% KBG.

I have some confidence the birder are going to fill in the spring with my winterizer app and biweekly 1/2 bag rate BSF apps.

My old lawn just required over-seeding every year. I finally feel like I have a lawn that will meet me half way if I apply pre-m properly and proactively apply serenade in the spring.

I am actually looking forward to tackling any of the POA that got through the reno, I am in a much better position to battle it than I ever was before, I can't thanks everyone enough for the suggestions and advice.