'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Discuss how to and whether you should renovate your lawn
Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » April 9th, 2020, 3:45 am

Andy The regular peletized gypsum looks very fresh. Maybe people are buying that thinking it is cheaper. $5 a bag versus $9 is deceiving without reading application rates.

Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » April 11th, 2020, 7:00 pm

I 'spot sprayed' with Weed B Gon today. I used up 9 gallons and only got about 3/4 of the yard sprayed. It took about three hours and I had to quit because I was wore out. Lots of weeds out there. Mostly dandelions and creeping charley, also low growing things I have no name for.

Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » April 15th, 2020, 9:45 pm

Today I applied one yard of compost in various places in the front lawn. It is really greening up, I think it is responding to the Menards faux Milorganite I put down a while back.Some of it I mowed all ready, and some literally hasn't grown at all. I applied the compost everywhere it isn't growing. The weed killer is really kicking in on the dandelions. Nice to see them shriveling up. There was lots of dandelions. The plan is to round up SOP and urea tomorrow. I am planning on using urea on the rear 19k rear lawn. I can get the compost for $12 a yard which makes it a very affordable product, if I use it judiciously. When it warms up in a few days I hope to take some pictures to post..

Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » April 16th, 2020, 9:47 pm

I applied another load of compost to the rear 'lawn' today.
Image
Between depleted neglected soil, dogs and 1/2 inch mowing height, the previous owner left lots of this. This is what i applied the compost to.
Image
The TTF seed that I dormant sowed in January is just starting to sprout. We're supposed to get six inches of snow tonight, which will be good to gently soak in the compost.
Image

Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » April 16th, 2020, 9:52 pm

This is the old pear tree that I 'top worked'. The idea s that if the grafts take it will heal better from the big cut where I topped it. I saved a few water sprouts to graft other varieties on next year. I tied the shoots down in order to keep my grafts in the dominant position.
Image
Some of the buds are starting to show life. It's too early to mean anything, they might just be drawing from sap in the scion. If they take I'll be surprised.
Image
Some of the backyard looks somewhat healthy, I think it is the former dogs bathroom area. I'm hoping to apply Menards Natural Lawn fertilizer this weekend. I will mix it with Boron and SOP in the rear and Boron only in front. Lord willing.
[url=https://postimg.cc/KRLdPJfL]Image[/url


Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » April 16th, 2020, 9:56 pm

This is an overview of the front lawn. It had been mowed to 1/2 inch somehow with a rotary mower. Some of it is starting to come back to life, and some has done nothing, so it's very spotty. Lots of dandelions kicking the bucket. I applied Sulphate of Potash today.
Image Two years ago a new septic system was installed. This is where the lines are. I'm not sure I should call this a lawn. Perhaps pre-lawn.
Image

Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » April 19th, 2020, 8:33 pm

In the last two days I put down ' fake Milorganite', SOP and Boron on the entire lawn. This week I plan to hit the weeds with a second round of Weed B Gon CCO. There are many holes and wash outs in the lawn, so I plan to but some loads of black dirt and begin to fill them. I won't over seed them until early fall, but let them settle until August. Some of them are ten inches deep, so none of this 1/4 inch at a time business. If I don't fill the holes I'll break my lawn tractor. Pushing the spreader is a arm breaking experience. I have a drag I made to level. I made it out of 4x 4's and hardware cloth. I plan on pulling it with the yard tractor. It works pretty well and was inexpensive.

Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » April 25th, 2020, 7:35 pm

The last several days I spot sprayed 22 gallons of CCO. Lots of dandelions and chickweed,wild strawberry and Creeping Charley. . In many places there are, or were more weeds than grass. Today on the rear yard I applied .5lbs of urea and then it drizzled all day long to wash it in. I'm thinking that in 2-3 weeks I might begin to see signs of a pre-lawn. Overall it is starting to color up and look somewhat healthy. Tomorrow I plan to hit the front lawn with Menards Nature's again (3rd drop this spring).

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andy10917
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Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
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Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by andy10917 » April 25th, 2020, 7:40 pm

Please tell me you're not really using brandname CCO for making 22 gallons of CCO, There is a far better way if you are...

TimmyG
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Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by TimmyG » April 25th, 2020, 10:38 pm

That, and I would spray 22 gallons over 22,000 sq ft, which is just how I roll and not what I would call "spot spraying".

Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » April 26th, 2020, 4:50 am

Andy What is the 'far better way' for concocting cco? I thought about buying straight Tryclopyr, but then thought that Weed B Gon brand also has dicamba and 24d and that they were necessary ingredients as well. Since this will be a season long battle, what route would some of you suggest? Timmy there are/were so many weeds that I did end up blanket spraying much of the pre-lawn.

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andy10917
Posts: 29112
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Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
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Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by andy10917 » April 26th, 2020, 8:23 am

Either you're confused or I'm totally lost...
I thought about buying straight Tryclopyr, but then thought that Weed B Gon brand also has dicamba and 24d and that they were necessary ingredients as well


Brandname Weed-B-Gon Chickweed, Clover and Oxalis Killer ("CCO") is pure 8% Triclopyr - no Dicamba or 2,4-D. The "regular" brandname Weed-B-Gon has 2,4-D, Dicamba and MCPP. Which one did you buy? There is no product that contains Triclopyr and 2,4-D and Dicamba.

Like I said, if you're using the CCO product on 22,000 sq ft, there are other products that contain up to 61% pure Triclopyr (7.5X stronger) and a gallon of that product for around $67. That's 60X the coverage of a pint of brandname Weed-B-Gon Chickweed, Clover and Oxalis Killer.

Read the label and see which product you bought, and the active ingredients in the product.

Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » April 26th, 2020, 8:41 am

Andy I was confused. I stand corrected. I just investigated a little more and you are absolutely correct about the cco ingredients. That being the case, if I get a bottle of triclopyr, is it to be mixed at the 8% rate?

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andy10917
Posts: 29112
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by andy10917 » April 26th, 2020, 9:37 am

No, you have to do the math to convert the amount needed in the dilution from the 8% to the 61% product, or read the label on the 61% product for lawn weed control. Be careful when reading the label - Triclopyr is often used to kill brush and woody plants also, but the application rates are stronger and are too much for lawns. Maybe someone else on the site has done the math and can post it.

TimmyG
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Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by TimmyG » April 29th, 2020, 12:49 am


Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » May 3rd, 2020, 9:25 pm

Thanks TimmyG for the link. My front lawn is coming along nicely. It's come far in one month. The weeds are really starting to die back. Someone even complimented me on this part of the lawn yesterday. It is still spotty with some areas refusing to come out of dormancy. I've been sprinkling compost on the worst areas. I got some Triclopyr 61.6%. As Andy stated this is about 7.5 times stronger than CCO. My math is the following, if I'm wrong I need someone to correct me. With Weed B Gon CCO, one adds 2 ounces per gallon. Two ounces equals 59 milliliters. If I divide 59 by 7.5 , I get 7.86. Hence, I should mix 7.86 mls per gallon to equivalate the weed b gon percentage of Triclopyr.? This is roughly 1.5 teaspoons per gallon of Triclopyr. This Tuesday or Wednesday I plan to do my next round of broad leaf spraying. I applied bag rate of Menards Nature's today to the front, and Urea at .5 lbs per K on the rear lawn. It is amazing how much one application of urea affected the color of the suffering rear yard this week.
Image

TimmyG
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Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by TimmyG » May 4th, 2020, 12:59 am

Where are you getting that "one adds 2 ounces per gallon" of Ortho CCO? The label states, "1 fl oz/gal. of water/200 sq ft". Thus, 2 ounces of CCO is appropriate for 400 sq ft.

Over what area are you spraying 1 gallon? If over 1000 sq ft, then the correct amount of Alligare Triclopyr 4 to mix into 1 gallon is provided on the label and quoted in the post I shared: "Mix 3/8 to ¾ fluid ounces of Alligare Triclopyr 4 per 1000 square feet in enough water to provide uniform coverage of the target area and apply at any time broadleaf weeds are susceptible."

But if you have your heart set on spraying 1 gallon over only 200 sq ft per the instructions for Ortho CCO, then you would divide "3/8 to ¾ fluid ounces" by five.

For lawn treatments, I tend to use the lower rate of Alligare Triclopyr 4.

Masbustelo
Posts: 251
Joined: September 14th, 2018, 10:56 pm
Location: Western Illinois, parallel to Lake Michigan.
Grass Type: Green Haze Mazama Rear, Trivialis front
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Some Experience

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by Masbustelo » May 4th, 2020, 4:51 am

TimmyG I am spot spraying, not blanket spraying. Ortho says for tank spraying 'add 2 fluid ounces per gallon of water for every 500 square feet of Northern lawns'. If mixing at this rate will kill weeds blanket spraying, it will kill them spot spraying as well. The Ortho label doesn't specify for spot spraying, so it seems this would be the necessary mix rate. 3/8 of a fluid ounce is 12 mls, so your low end mix rate is a little higher than what I am going to start out with. If my dilution is ineffective, I'll up it. However, I think my basic math is solid giving me the mix percentage of Triclopyr matching the two brands. Having said this, my math is often questionable. Measure twice, cut three times. Math is a theory, not a science.

TimmyG
Posts: 2244
Joined: May 15th, 2012, 6:04 pm
Location: Dracut, MA
Grass Type: Northern Mix
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Experienced

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by TimmyG » May 4th, 2020, 1:55 pm

There's no difference (or should be no difference) between blanket spraying and spot spraying when it comes to the appropriate rate of application. It's up to you to calibrate your spot spraying technique, which can be difficult.

BTW, 2 oz over 500 sq ft is 4 oz over 1000 sq ft. Divide that by your 7.5 conversion, and you get an equivalent 0.53 oz per 1000 sq ft for the Alligare product. That's right in the middle of the range suggested by Alligare. I suggest checking your math again.

TimmyG
Posts: 2244
Joined: May 15th, 2012, 6:04 pm
Location: Dracut, MA
Grass Type: Northern Mix
Lawn Size: 20000-1 acre
Level: Experienced

Re: 'New' House old lawn Restoration 2020

Post by TimmyG » May 4th, 2020, 2:02 pm

Long story short, there's no need to convert or inherit the risk of math errors. Just follow the label of the different product.

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