Fence posts

[new to this]

I'm looking to install a 6'x8' fence and the world seems to be all over the place as to how the posts should be set. Concrete, just rock, just native soil...

My gut says packed with rock and native soil is best, but concrete sounds so much sturdier - until the post shrinks and the concrete allows water to eat the post away.

So as of now I'm planning 42" deep hole, 4"-6" of rock in the bottom then packing rock and soil the rest of the way to the top. Can anybody convince me otherwise?

Thanks.

[Tsmith]

For that size height I believe at least every other post should be concrete especially if it's not the type of fence that wind can blow through.




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[CarolinaMatt]

Lowes came out and installed my 6 foot vinyl fence and used concrete for every post. It is as solid as can be. What type of soil do you have? I have red clay/LOAM and so they said since it moves around a good bit it needed to be concrete as rocks/crushed products would be moved around.

Let us know what you decide and good luck!

[new to this]

I'm pretty much sand...just ask Andy!! Solid fence, minimal gaps.

My neighbor did the every other post thing 15yrs ago and its still as solid as it was the first week.

I think I have my answer...at minimum it'll be every other. Thanks!

[new to this]

Job done. Talked with landscapers and other fence pros, they all agreed that I should stay away from concrete with wood posts; save the concrete for metal and vinyl. My sandy soil was nothing but apple and plum size rocks after the first 18". It was a pipe dream to try and go 42" with a 1.5HP one man auger, I would say half are at 36", the rest are 32". Fence pros said they go anywhere from 30"-36". Pulling all the rock I pulled out was great for packing and locking in the posts, they are rock solid now. Hope they're just as solid next spring.

[turf_toes]

Job done. Talked with landscapers and other fence pros, they all agreed that I should stay away from concrete with wood posts; save the concrete for metal and vinyl. My sandy soil was nothing but apple and plum size rocks after the first 18". It was a pipe dream to try and go 42" with a 1.5HP one man auger, I would say half are at 36", the rest are 32". Fence pros said they go anywhere from 30"-36". Pulling all the rock I pulled out was great for packing and locking in the posts, they are rock solid now. Hope they're just as solid next spring.

Late to this thread. But your pros are right. Any pro who who puts wood posts in concrete is just an amateur with a truck.

I worked for a fence company while working my way through college. My boss used to say anybody with a truck and a pair of pliers thinks they can install fences. I still, 25 years later, can't help cringing driving by crappy fence installs and wondering how someone got paid for that job. (wood fences that are stacked to create what looks like steps, split rail fences where the wire is left higher than the top rail, etc)

The problem with wood posts, even treated lumber, and concrete is the water tends to pool around the post and eventually cause premature rotting and failure of the post.

Then, good luck digging that concrete encased stub post out of the ground so you can replace it.

Wood posts should always be installed in gravel (which allows water to drain).


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[new to this]

Guess I chose wisely not using concrete with wood. Probably could've used more gravel...next time?

[dfw_pilot]

Looks great!

I, too, am against concrete with wood posts. Concrete rots the wood because the water doesn't drain and is a pain to remove later. My wife's uncle built an entire pole barn/garage with wood posts surrounded by gravel. When I put up a weather station, I used a 4x4 treated post and surrounded it with crushed granite packed in tight. The post doesn't move and I don't have a concrete lump to remove later.

[llO0DQLE]

Late to this thread. But your pros are right. Any pro who who puts wood posts in concrete is just an amateur with a truck.

The problem with wood posts, even treated lumber, and concrete is the water tends to pool around the post and eventually cause premature rotting and failure of the post.

Then, good luck digging that concrete encased stub post out of the ground so you can replace it.

Wood posts should always be installed in gravel (which allows water to drain).


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Hmm... I'm building a fence right now and the way we're doing it is we dug 3 foot holes for each post, which is 6x6x10. I have clay soil underneath the topsoil and we're using the same soil to put around the post in the hole in the bottom 2'6" -ish part of the hole, tamped down. The remaining 6"-ish at the top is filled with concrete. I don't know anything about fencing, my father-in-law is the one heading the project and I believe he knows what he's doing. He's 60 y.o. DIY type of guy, very successful in his career, smart man, built 6 fences (that have all lasted), 6 basements and decks in his lifetime so far.. He mentioned using gravel at first for drainage and then for some reason, decided to just use the clay at the bottom. What do you think?

[turf_toes]

Late to this thread. But your pros are right. Any pro who who puts wood posts in concrete is just an amateur with a truck.

The problem with wood posts, even treated lumber, and concrete is the water tends to pool around the post and eventually cause premature rotting and failure of the post.

Then, good luck digging that concrete encased stub post out of the ground so you can replace it.

Wood posts should always be installed in gravel (which allows water to drain).


Sent from my iOS device using the Yard Help App

Hmm... I'm building a fence right now and the way we're doing it is we dug 3 foot holes for each post, which is 6x6x10. I have clay soil underneath the topsoil and we're using the same soil to put around the post in the hole in the bottom 2'6" -ish part of the hole, tamped down. The remaining 6"-ish at the top is filled with concrete. I don't know anything about fencing, my father-in-law is the one heading the project and I believe he knows what he's doing. He's 60 y.o. DIY type of guy, very successful in his career, smart man, built 6 fences (that have all lasted), 6 basements and decks in his lifetime so far.. He mentioned using gravel at first for drainage and then for some reason, decided to just use the clay at the bottom. What do you think?

I would insist on straight gravel.

There is no reason to use concrete.

If you are concerned about the post being secure and stable, buy a tamping bar.

http://www.acehardware.com/product/inde ... pla_954561

(Use the flat end to pound the gravel down around the post).

The fences I installed this way are still there 25-years later.

Another problem with concrete is you are setting your posts as you go.

A professional will run a string line at the top to your posts are all exactly level and plumb. Then will go back when the job is complete to ensure both level and plumb. (By adjusting the post and then tamping it down)

How are you gonna do that if it is already set in concrete?

Also, if your fence is being installed on an incline or decline, don't step the fence sections. (So they look like steps going up a hill). That's a sure sign of a bad installation. You should be racking the fence sections so each section of fence matches up perfectly)



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[new to this]

I guess I don't get the theory of concrete at the top, besides its easier to dig out? With clay soil I would stick to gravel like TT says.

In the past 16 years I've never been happier. I finally don't have to look at my neighbors extremes, scalping his weed and crabgrass or letting it grow 2'-3' tall...not to mention his misclaneous piles of branches and junk. He was an original land owner when this subdivision was put in, he received fair money from the builder for the land he sold, but to this day he moans and groans about it. Rant off.

[llO0DQLE]

Another problem with concrete is you are setting your posts as you go.

A professional will run a string line at the top to your posts are all exactly level and plumb. Then will go back when the job is complete to ensure both level and plumb. (By adjusting the post and then tamping it down)

How are you gonna do that if it is already set in concrete?

Also, if your fence is being installed on an incline or decline, don't step the fence sections. (So they look like steps going up a hill). That's a sure sign of a bad installation. You should be racking the fence sections so each section of fence matches up perfectly)



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We do have a line stringed to check for alignment. See pic below. We set the posts at the ends first for this reason so we can run the line from front to back. We are checking each post for alignment as we put it in and while we're tamping the clay (apparently it's mostly silt as per my jar test, http://aroundtheyard.com/northern/clay-t18145.html), we're double-checking constantly. Having the clay/silt base tamped down at the bottom makes it really secure and the concrete at the top is just the finishing touch, after we're satisfied with the alignment. Not saying this is best practice, just explaining how we've done it so far. My father-in-law did talk about how the stringers will be going down on a gradual decline and it will not be stepped. We're going to mark 6 feet from the bottom on each post and string a line running through all the posts at those points and that will give us the angle the stringers will go so they won't be stepped. Hope that makes sense. Thanks for your advice TT, I will discuss it with my father-in-law.

[llO0DQLE]

I guess I don't get the theory of concrete at the top, besides its easier to dig out? With clay soil I would stick to gravel like TT says.

Hmm..I don't know. I guess the idea is just for more stability?

[new to this]

I guess I don't get the theory of concrete at the top, besides its easier to dig out? With clay soil I would stick to gravel like TT says.

Hmm..I don't know. I guess the idea is just for more stability?

If concrete I would think you'd want the concrete at the bottom so if you had any swaying it would have to push that chunk of concrete at the bottom pushing against 3' deep soil. When the concrete sits on top it just has to push the dirt at the top of the hole - little resistance. I may not be on the right page, but think I'm in the right chapter. I also read a good piece of advice...if you have any leftover dirt after your post is set you didn't pack it hard enough.