Fall Nitrogen Regimens

[greenrebellion]

How dangerous is it if I apply 1lb/K Urea 5 days apart just once? The weather forecast is calling for plenty of rain and I'd love to get an app in my backyard reno before it becomes all mushy. Based on forecast, I can either go tonight ahead of rain (day 5) or wait till day 10 or so once things dry out a bit post rain.

[Fullheadofturf1234]

From what I understand this is ok. On the regimen you are allowed up to 2lb of urea per thousand weekly.

[andy10917]

A good rule of thumb is that you shouldn't put down more than 2 lbs/K of Urea in any 14-day period. So, don't keep shortening the cycle, but falling back to the normal schedule next week is fine (with a little caution).

[ken-n-nancy]

From what I understand this is ok. On the regimen you are allowed up to 2lb of urea per thousand weekly.

I think that application schedule would have significant risk of burning the lawn, and I wouldn't recommend it. That would be a rate of basically 4#N/ksqft in a month.

The "normal guideline" is 1#N/ksqft per month, which is approx 2#urea/ksqft each month.

For aggressive applications, 2#N/ksqft per month is permitted, which is approx 4#urea/ksqft each month. However, this level of application really needs to be split out into multiple smaller applications -- ideally weekly, but potentially every two weeks.

[Fullheadofturf1234]

I reread the postandI guess I got confused with the winterizing app, that being 1# of N all at once.

[Fullheadofturf1234]

Andy, is it possible to continue this regimen in the spring ?
Reason I’m asking is to help areas that need to spread put and recover, that did not 100% by the time spring arrives 2019.
IMO the temps are similar now to april and may... so the grass will respond the same way.
I can make a new thread if need be.

[andy10917]

The Philes regimen for a new lawn facing its first Spring is pretty close to the Fall Nitrogen regimen, but has a slight twist here and there. I'd recommend it strongly. I'll be adding some new techniques in the Spring to the Philes regimen if final testing comes out well.

[KBGkicksazz]

So the philes applies in spring too for a new lawn?

I thought new lawns are more susceptible to N burn.

The Philes regimen for a new lawn facing its first Spring is pretty close to the Fall Nitrogen regimen, but has a slight twist here and there. I'd recommend it strongly. I'll be adding some new techniques in the Spring to the Philes regimen if final testing comes out well.

[andy10917]

Have you read it? It's very specifically discussing April, May and June.

I don't know where the idea of "N burn" comes from. In the many renovations I've done, I've never seen a renovation be any more susceptible to Nitrogen issues than any other lawn. The premise is "small feedings often".

[This is me]

After the 3rd application last Thursday and a lot of rain in September, my lawn is exploding when the sun is out. Even the grub affected patch seem to be recovering and there's more green spreading in the patch. Still mow once a week but I'm definitely breaking the 1/3 rule. I just can't find the time to mow it more often. My procedure is to spread the Urea, mow, and then water(if there's no rain coming for the next day).
I plan on getting a mow in tomorrow(Wednesday) if it's dry enough and then Urea and Mow on Sunday. It gets dark so quick now that doing any lawn work after work is tough.

[ryeguy]

I seeded some PRG and put down milo on Sept 8. I've mowed it twice now. How long should I wait before hitting it with urea?

[andy10917]

I'll repeat the same exact answer again: do not apply fertilizer until Sprout-and-Pout is completed. The lawn doesn't care if it you mowed it every day. Once S&P is done, the regimen can be started and continued.

There is no other information that you need.

[Green]

As much as I was hoping to do something just a bit more aggressive this year, it wasn't meant to be...the timing just didn't work out, so I'm doing more of a standard program instead. So glad I did a Philes-type program this past Spring on the reseeded areas, though. Between that and low-rate PGR apps this year, there seems to be little need for a full-blown aggressive program this Fall, anyway, so I'm not complaining one bit (except for the 300 square feet of main lawn area that's still badly infested with Triv).

[PSU4ME]

Hey Andy,
Does different type of grass (KBG vs TTTF) stop growing at different times?

[andy10917]

Not significantly

[Fullheadofturf1234]

Im confused when to stop the weekly apps. Is this the first frost ? Or when I noticed the slow down?

Also, for the winterizier app, Is there a “grace” period between noticing that top has stopped? Or does the winterizer go down right away?

[Marinegrunt]

Im confused when to stop the weekly apps. Is this the first frost ? Or when I noticed the slow down?

Also, for the winterizier app, Is there a “grace” period between noticing that top has stopped? Or does the winterizer go down right away?

Andy states that the average first frost date tends to precede stoppage of growth by 3-4 weeks so stop your nitrogen apps on your average first frost date. He refers to the period from then until your grass stops growing as "the pause". Once you notice you aren't getting any clippings when you mow or, your grass completely stops growing, apply your winterizer app.

Just to recap, stop all nitrogen apps on your average first frost date. You are now going into the pause. Your grass should stop growing about 3-4 weeks later. Once you have no growth apply winterizer app and the roots will store it for spring green up.

[Fullheadofturf1234]

So based off the highs and lows it looks like I can at least keep going through October 20th in metro detroit... lowest predicted during this time is 41*

How long does N from urea stay in the soil?
If i have a week of good weather but I know the following will be the first frost can I still apply the application thst week?

[Maizan24]

So based off the highs and lows it looks like I can at least keep going through October 20th in metro detroit... lowest predicted during this time is 41*

How long does N from urea stay in the soil?
If i have a week of good weather but I know the following will be the first frost can I still apply the application thst week?

Use the link Andy posted on the 1st page. It's at the bottom of his instructional post. Type in your zip and it will give you your average date. Don't go off the forecast. It's not always spot on and can change on a dime depending on how mother nature is feeling. Especially for an extended forecast.

According to my location I should be done until winterize time with my average being the 5th of October.

[Maizan24]

Andy states that the average first frost date tends to precede stoppage of growth by 3-4 weeks so stop your nitrogen apps on your average first frost date. He refers to the period from then until your grass stops growing as "the pause". Once you notice you aren't getting any clippings when you mow or, your grass completely stops growing, apply your winterizer app.

Just to recap, stop all nitrogen apps on your average first frost date. You are now going into the pause. Your grass should stop growing about 3-4 weeks later. Once you have no growth apply winterizer app and the roots will store it for spring green up.

Guess now I'm a little confused too.

"When the first-frost occurs in your area, you want let the grass slow down the top-growth naturally -- continued Urea or AS treatments will force continued growth."

Guess I read that as when you actually get a frost you should stop your apps. Can I please get a little clarification? First year doing this and so far the results have been promising. Just want to make sure I'm following the program the right way.