Do I need to use Fungicide?

[RockinMyLawn]

Just entered my first summer doing things on my own without paying a chem lawn company to take care of things.

But I still get their newsletter & my neighbor's chem lawn company newsletter.

What caught my eye yesterday reading these newsletters was the reminder that June is the time to get fungicide applied to our area Zone 7 TTTF lawns.

One newsletter even provided the chem brand it was applying : Armada 50 WDG @ 0.6 - 1.2 oz per 1K sqft.

So what is the ATY best practice when applying disease control: Preventative or response only?

[bernstem]

Generally, we recommend against chemical fungicide application unless there is a known disease concern. They are expensive and do have potential effects on the normal soil microbiology. In addition, the fungicide used should be targeted to the disease that you need to treat/prevent. Not all fungicides treat all diseases.

Armada is a good, broad spectrum fungicide, but is expensive. Another similar fungicide (with the same classes of agents) that I like better is Headway.

[BoatDrinksQ5]

A lot (few?) folks here focus on prevention with probiotic style preventative options, organic/natural disease preventers. Serenade, Companion, Cracked Corn, and Actinovate come to mind right off the bat. Often with bi-weekly or monthly applications. Especially in locations of past issues or high risk areas (damp/shady areas, slow growth areas, or neighbor that waters every day).

[oze]

I am in my first year of only using biological antifungals on my lawn. I've sprayed Serenade at 2oz/gallon every 2 weeks as a preventative, but had to up it to 4oz/gallon for a couple of apps when powdery mildew started to appear. I am also spraying Potassium Phosphite with Potassium Silicate @ 3oz/gallon every 3 weeks, in the hope of heading off the dreaded pythium blight outbreak that always threatens some of my soggy zones. So far, so good. As Andy insists, I have stayed the course and have not resorted to chemical fungicides, even with the (relatively mild) outbreak of powdery mildew.

[Billy]

If you're managing tall fescue in VA, I think it's almost a sure bet that you're going to see some brown patch activity in the summer. Since it's starting to get warm outside, that's probably the lawn services are targeting. However, I think you can get through most summers without fungicide apps to manage it. The keys are:

1) Drop N rates or cease N fertilization altogether in the summer
*) VA Tech turf faculty recommend avoiding all N fertilization during the summer months

2) Raise your mowing height
*) Mow as high as the mower will go

3) Irrigate only as much as necessary.
*) Overwatering is just as bad as underwatering

Most brown patch problems in tall fescue lawns can be manager by fertilizing less, watering less, and mowing higher.

[northeastlawn]

Any suggestions for a northern mix (PR, KBG, FF) lawn in mass?

I keeping seeing serenade mentioned and not sure if I should be using it.

I do have slight signs of some fungus after a few days or wet weather, but nothing notable.i have some brown threads of grass here and there but starting to think that may be due to needing water now.

Grass height is 3.5" and I have been dropping BSF every other week at bag rate.

[ Post made via iPhone ]

[tlinden]

@northeast - Watch out, it can spread fast. Post some photos and/or look at the identification sites. I had to put some currative stuff down because I didn't think it was bad and then got busy with other things..

[oze]

Serenade and the other biologicals are better at preventing, rather than curing fungal diseases. I think of it this way: the biologicals are the condoms, while the chemicals are the penicillin. More or less.

[RockinMyLawn]

If you're managing tall fescue in VA, I think it's almost a sure bet that you're going to see some brown patch activity in the summer. Since it's starting to get warm outside, that's probably the lawn services are targeting. However, I think you can get through most summers without fungicide apps to manage it. The keys are:

1) Drop N rates or cease N fertilization altogether in the summer
*) VA Tech turf faculty recommend avoiding all N fertilization during the summer months

2) Raise your mowing height
*) Mow as high as the mower will go

3) Irrigate only as much as necessary.
*) Overwatering is just as bad as underwatering

Most brown patch problems in tall fescue lawns can be manager by fertilizing less, watering less, and mowing higher.

Billy - Thanks for the feedback.

I've been in the house for 3 seasons now & going on 4th here & never partook in any of the chem lawn disease prevention treatments.
I followed 2 of your 3 steps above & it has worked well for me or at least I didn't have big problems that I had noticed.

Watering being the one step that was not adhere to because the lawn look heat stressed.
But I've gone to a morning night shift watering routine (2am -7am) & the lawn is looking well so far.

That said, this is my first year also under Andy's soil test guidance & Milo is a component of that.

Was planning to drop a load of Milo on July 4th. Thoughts?

[nclawnguy]

I have cool season lawn in NC, I've had both tttf and kbg. About 4 years or so ago I started applying preventative fungicides (chemical) and have hardly any disease, before that brown patch was a yearly occurrence in my lawn. If you have tall fescue in the southeast, brown patch is almost inevitable and the more dangerous grey leaf spot can happen in late summer. Different folks on this site manage disease differently, some preventive, some only when disease is present and some use biological and some use chemical fungicides.

[McLovin]

Othertime has a nice thread on his NoVA fungicide regimen here:

http://aroundtheyard.com/northern/almos ... =othertime

I am doing the ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure with chemical fungicides this summer, at least on the areas that get brown patch every year.

[Billy]

Billy - Thanks for the feedback.

I've been in the house for 3 seasons now & going on 4th here & never partook in any of the chem lawn disease prevention treatments.
I followed 2 of your 3 steps above & it has worked well for me or at least I didn't have big problems that I had noticed.

Watering being the one step that was not adhere to because the lawn look heat stressed.
But I've gone to a morning night shift watering routine (2am -7am) & the lawn is looking well so far.

That said, this is my first year also under Andy's soil test guidance & Milo is a component of that.

Was planning to drop a load of Milo on July 4th. Thoughts?

Some guys have already covered the sad reality here: if you're managing tall fescue in the transition zone, brown patch is always going to be a battle for you. It's just the nature of the beast. There's a tendency to over-irrigate transition zone tall fescue in the summertime because it just naturally declines in summer weather. Tall fescue grows best in 70 degree weather and we're asking it to perform in 90 degree weather. So, irrigation decisions should be made on soil moisture (use a soil probe or a screw driver) and plant response (if the leaves are folded, have a purplish tint, and leave your footprints when you walk on it, it needs water). I might also suggest backing up your irrigation times. The period of leaf wetness is important in brown patch development. Watering too early (2 am, for instance), keeps the grass wet for a longer period than watering later.

On the fertilizer, I think the decision depends on where you are in your yearly nutrient budget. Tall fescue usually won't need any more than 4-4.5# N/M/yr. So, if you've delivered at least 1# N/M already, I wouldn't try to add more during the stressful period.

[RockinMyLawn]

Some guys have already covered the sad reality here: if you're managing tall fescue in the transition zone, brown patch is always going to be a battle for you. It's just the nature of the beast. There's a tendency to over-irrigate transition zone tall fescue in the summertime because it just naturally declines in summer weather. Tall fescue grows best in 70 degree weather and we're asking it to perform in 90 degree weather. So, irrigation decisions should be made on soil moisture (use a soil probe or a screw driver) and plant response (if the leaves are folded, have a purplish tint, and leave your footprints when you walk on it, it needs water). I might also suggest backing up your irrigation times. The period of leaf wetness is important in brown patch development. Watering too early (2 am, for instance), keeps the grass wet for a longer period than watering later.

Interesting - Prior to this year, I had water 5am-8am & 6pm-8pm if the zone hadn't finished - in the spring/summer/fall seasons using my Rainbird irrigation system without any issues & any disease treatments.

Based on this recent thread about watering at night, I thought I'd move it back till 2am-7am.
But now that may not give the grass enough daylight time to dry out you say?
Aren't I trying to give it the right amount of H20 while minimizing evapotransportation?

On the fertilizer, I think the decision depends on where you are in your yearly nutrient budget. Tall fescue usually won't need any more than 4-4.5# N/M/yr. So, if you've delivered at least 1# N/M already, I wouldn't try to add more during the stressful period.

andy10917 actually was OK in his Soil Test Interpretation for me to add some N via Milo

Here's my soil test.

[Billy]

Interesting - Prior to this year, I had water 5am-8am & 6pm-8pm if the zone hadn't finished - in the spring/summer/fall seasons using my Rainbird irrigation system without any issues & any disease treatments.

Based on this recent thread about watering at night, I thought I'd move it back till 2am-7am.
But now that may not give the grass enough daylight time to dry out you say?
Aren't I trying to give it the right amount of H20 while minimizing evapotransportation?

It's not surprising to hear some different practices out there. There is more than one way to skin this cat.

However, for most turf diseases the period of leaf wetness (how long the leaf surface is wet) factors into disease incidence. The longer the plant remains wet, the higher chance you have for disease infection. When lawns are watered at night, the plants often stay wet until the dew burns off the next morning. But, if you water near sunrise, you're not making the grass stay wet any longer than it naturally would have -- thus you're reducing the period of leaf wetness and reducing your chance for disease infection. It's something that's easy to do, reduces the chance of disease, and costs nothing to do. Can't get any easier than that

I wouldn't worry about water evaorpating from irrigation applications. That's an old wives tale that isn't backed up by science. When irrigating in the middle of the day, less than 1% of that water is lost to evaporation. I think most of us can live with that.

andy10917 actually was OK in his Soil Test Interpretation for me to add some N via Milo

Here's my soil test.

The soil test interpretation you linked here is a big vague about N recommendations. It does say that using complete fertilizers will deliver some N along with other nutrients (which is true). It also recommends to avoid fertilizer apps (which I would assume includes N) from July 1 to Aug 15. I like that idea, but I think I might expand on it, since brown patch conditions in VA are often June (or sometimes late-May) through Aug, so I would avoid N apps during June, July, and August (which is also the recommendation from the turf profs at Virginia Tech).

Good luck this year!

[Michael Wise]

With my yard, it has dew on it from sundown until it burns off in the morning. Watering at night does not keep my lawn wet longer. If I think about it, it would probably keep the grass wet longer if I watered in the morning.

[RockinMyLawn]

Interesting - Prior to this year, I had water 5am-8am & 6pm-8pm if the zone hadn't finished - in the spring/summer/fall seasons using my Rainbird irrigation system without any issues & any disease treatments.

Based on this recent thread about watering at night, I thought I'd move it back till 2am-7am.
But now that may not give the grass enough daylight time to dry out you say?
Aren't I trying to give it the right amount of H20 while minimizing evapotranspiration?

It's not surprising to hear some different practices out there. There is more than one way to skin this cat.

However, for most turf diseases the period of leaf wetness (how long the leaf surface is wet) factors into disease incidence. The longer the plant remains wet, the higher chance you have for disease infection. When lawns are watered at night, the plants often stay wet until the dew burns off the next morning. But, if you water near sunrise, you're not making the grass stay wet any longer than it naturally would have -- thus you're reducing the period of leaf wetness and reducing your chance for disease infection. It's something that's easy to do, reduces the chance of disease, and costs nothing to do. Can't get any easier than that

I wouldn't worry about water evaorpating from irrigation applications. That's an old wives tale that isn't backed up by science. When irrigating in the middle of the day, less than 1% of that water is lost to evaporation. I think most of us can live with that.

All good points.
I've moved my timer forward to a 4AM-7AM window. This will give my 9 zones - a 3 hours window else it'll delay till the next day - which is fine.

andy10917 actually was OK in his Soil Test Interpretation for me to add some N via Milo

Here's my soil test.

The soil test interpretation you linked here is a big vague about N recommendations. It does say that using complete fertilizers will deliver some N along with other nutrients (which is true). It also recommends to avoid fertilizer apps (which I would assume includes N) from July 1 to Aug 15. I like that idea, but I think I might expand on it, since brown patch conditions in VA are often June (or sometimes late-May) through Aug, so I would avoid N apps during June, July, and August (which is also the recommendation from the turf profs at Virginia Tech).

Good luck this year!

Yeah, I laid down a bag of 10-10-10 Fert on the 31st of May as directed & was going to sit out the summer as suggested except for the Milo on the 4th.

This might be an easier summer than i thought! Thanks for the feedback billy!

[Green]

Echoing the sentiment posted above...From what I understand, a one-time preventative fungicide app, randomly applied during the Spring/Summer, might not be a good use of chemicals or money. In fact, it could be a very bad use.

[Green]

All good points.
I've moved my timer forward to a 4AM-7AM window. This will give my 9 zones - a 3 hours window else it'll delay till the next day - which is fine.

Cool...what controller do you have that automatically delays the selected schedule to the next day if a conflict arises?

[lawndad]

If you're managing tall fescue in VA, I think it's almost a sure bet that you're going to see some brown patch activity in the summer. Since it's starting to get warm outside, that's probably the lawn services are targeting. However, I think you can get through most summers without fungicide apps to manage it. The keys are:

1) Drop N rates or cease N fertilization altogether in the summer
*) VA Tech turf faculty recommend avoiding all N fertilization during the summer months

2) Raise your mowing height
*) Mow as high as the mower will go

3) Irrigate only as much as necessary.
*) Overwatering is just as bad as underwatering

Most brown patch problems in tall fescue lawns can be manager by fertilizing less, watering less, and mowing higher.

Billy, a question about the mower height... I always thought if you go too high (4") it would leave the grass too tall making it difficult for it to dry out thus making the disease worse? My Honda goes to 4" but I normally keep my tall fescue at 3 1/2".


Sent from my iOS device using the Yard Help App.

[RockinMyLawn]

All good points.
I've moved my timer forward to a 4AM-7AM window. This will give my 9 zones - a 3 hours window else it'll delay till the next day - which is fine.

Cool...what controller do you have that automatically delays the selected schedule to the next day if a conflict arises?

I have a Rain Bird ESP-SMT.
Based on last year's schedule: 4am-8am & 7pm-8.30pm & blocking out the weekends, my 9 zones were active on probably for 4 out of the 5 weekdays.

This year based on Bill's recommendation, I've set it @ 4-7am & don't block out the weekends, the 9 zones are getting watered about 2-3x a week & the sprinklers are on everyday - not for all zones of course.