Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Kentucky bluegrass, Fescue, Rye and Bent, etc
Marinegrunt
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Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by Marinegrunt » September 28th, 2017, 2:25 pm

As some of you know I had a fungus attack my reno so had to order some more seed. I used Hogan Blend tttf + 10% kbg. My first 100 lbs of seed for the reno consisted of Firewall, Cochise IV, Bullseye, LS 1200, Houndog 8, and NuGlade. They don't have online ordering so you have to call to order. When I called I told then what cultivars were in my original seed. I could tell he was writing then down because he had me repeat a few. I also told them if they were out of any cultivar that's fine just don't add any new one that wasn't in my original order. They said that's just fine we can do that.

Anyways, I get the seed via FedEx this morning. The cultivars listed are Falcon IV, Paramount, Firewall, Bullseye, Cochise IV, and Award. They did exactly what I asked them not to do. I emailed and they apologised for the mix up but said they use about 8 different cultivars which are interchangeable and you can't tell the difference between them. He said the only difference is brown patch resistance. He said same goes for kbg as long as they are in the same type/classification. So, since NuGlade and Award and both compact midnight they look the same.There was more sales pitch but these were the main points.

When I emailed I told him I'm spot seeding not over seeding. Some areas need almost completely reseeded and other areas don't need any at all. I was worried about some areas having 3 different cultivars and, an area directly next to it, won't have those.

I'm sure it's not going to be that noticeable and probably not at all. I've done so much work I worry about the little things. You all know what I mean. So far I've spent $500 on seed from them. He basically just explained how the cultivars will look the same and that's it. I can email with any other questions. I even mentioned if I knew I was going to get different cultivars I would've ordered the seed separate.

What do you think? If they all look exaxtly the same I'm probably okay with it. I just don't want patch areas that are a little different in color, growing speed, etc. I could always over seed the whole yard with the new cultivars but will have to buy more seed.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by JohnP » September 28th, 2017, 3:32 pm

I've not ordered from them before, but are they unable to send only the Firewall, Cochise and Bullseye? They did what you specifically asked them not to.

I would ask for (and expect them to) make it right if they're able.

If they just get the mix from someone else in a huge tank then I wouldn't expect them to split the seeds...but seems to me like they get them and then make the mix. They made your mix wrong.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by SNOWBOB11 » September 28th, 2017, 4:27 pm

If there able to get the same cultivar as you used before I would tell them you want it exchanged. Why take the chance that there is a difference? Do you really think there going to tell you that you'll notice a difference? Are you going to be ok if it looks really close but just a slight bit off? If it was me I wouldn't take the chance, especially being your spot seeding.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by Marinegrunt » September 28th, 2017, 4:33 pm

I'm sure they mix the seed themselves and it doesn't come like that. Many cultivars come from different producers. Since they have one called The Hogan Blend, which is the TTTF, I bet they already have a bunch of that mixed up. They then probably add the KBG. They do also sell the TTTF cultivars separate. My sales reciept says The Hogan Blend + 10% NuGlade but the label has Award listed. I bet they already had a big order for the tttf + 10% so just through my order in the mix. I do know that they sometimes use the other cultivars they sent me. It probably just depends how much of each cultivar they have on hand.

I'm sure it would like fine but I don't feel it's right. If for some reason does turn out "patchy" looking in areas are they going to come do a reno for me? We both know the answer to that. Also, it's just the point of it. He apologized for the mix up but then typed 3 good sized paragraphs how they all look the same anyways. Maybe he's right and I'd be fine with it. I guess I'm just nervous to take the chance. Plus, I need to get the down asap. It's already late in the year for a spot seed.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by PSU4ME » September 28th, 2017, 4:41 pm

I don't see why they wouldn't change them out for you. The reason you buy by the cultivar is because you want those exact one vs buying a bag of Pennington.

Now could you probably use it? Sure but I'd at least expect him to give you a trouble free option.

Me personally, I'd try to replace it as it would always drive me crazy considering all the work we do to make it look perfect - whatever perfect means to you!


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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by Marinegrunt » September 28th, 2017, 5:44 pm

Snowbob.... I specifically told them that if they only had maybe 2 of the original cultivars I was fine with that. I told them I didn't want any new. I even emailed the same info 5 days before that for a quote.

PSU.... When I do something I tend to go a little overboard. I put as much work into as I have too so I can make it look the best that I can. If I end up using it I guarantee I'll be looking every year to see if I notice a difference. If I look hard enough I'm sure I'll notice something. It might not have anything to do with the cultivars but will be hard not to blame it on that.

I started typing an email earlier basically saying I don't want to blame them if there ever is any variation in color. Even if it's something else causing the color it will be hard not to pass blame. It would be the only variable since everything else was done identical.

They probably don't want to eat the seed profit or the shipping. If they have to mail more it's probably cheaper for them to tell me to keep the seed and then mail more. I can't believe they didn't offer a solution after I sent the first email. I was nice about it but they knew I was concerned. They probably try and pull the "it all looks the same" and then see what the customer says next before offering a solution.

I start working 70 hour weeks starting Monday so was hoping I would get the seed down this weekend. It's always something.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by JohnP » September 28th, 2017, 6:04 pm

Also your neighbor has studied your lawn enough, he will notice the difference and mention it. That alone isn't worth it.

They should have cross shipped you a replacement pronto. Send the new out while they wait for your return. You've gone through enough to get to this point. It should be shipped with only the ones you have, not new at this point. Whether you spent $5 or $500.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by SNOWBOB11 » September 28th, 2017, 7:28 pm

As confusing and aggravating as it will be to wait for them to send the replacement seed, if I were you I'd just wait and get the seed you wanted in the first place. No sence dropping seed now just to get it over with, to spend the next ten years having it in the back of your mind. Just stop, take a deep breath, and get the same cultivar as before. And don't let them try and talk you into using it. You should get what you paid for in the first place.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by Marinegrunt » September 28th, 2017, 7:57 pm

JohnP wrote:
September 28th, 2017, 6:04 pm
Also your neighbor has studied your lawn enough, he will notice the difference and mention it. That alone isn't worth it.
Ha! I wouldn't expect anything less out of you John! I actually took a video of him staring yesterday while I was mowing. You see his head move and hear the mower getting louder as it gets closer to my phone so you can tell he's following my movement. There was one point when I looked at him, put my palms up, and shrugged kind of gesturing "do you need something or what is it"? It didn't phase him at all and he kept on staring. It's crazy.

I agree they should send a replacement. He should have offered when I sent an email. I just sent another one explaining how it will be hard not to blame the cultivars if anything should come up especially with color. I told him I'd be lying if I said it wouldn't bother me spot seeding with 3 different cultivars. There's a reason I told them not to do exactly what they did. If I wouldn't have said anything that would be different and I wouldn't blame them. Obviously it's their screw up because my reciept says tttf + NuGlade but the tag has Award listed. I would have turned down the order if the only option was what they sent and I would've ordered elsewhere. I'm sure if I push a little they make it right. They've been a pleasure to deal with so far and have always promptly answered any questions I've had.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by HoosierLawnGnome » September 28th, 2017, 8:22 pm

That's BS and horrible way to treat an obviously discerning customer. I'd demand they overnight me the seed promised given the quickly closing seeding window.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by Green » September 28th, 2017, 8:32 pm

These guys are perfectionists, so they should understand if you are, too. In my experience, talking on the phone is a lot better than emailing when it comes to lots of people, and Bob Hogan loves to talk on the phone...so why not give them a call and talk with Bob or Steven (Stephen?) directly. I would tell them that you understand that it's a small order and you don't want to waste a lot of their and your time...but you're a perfectionist, and you would like the correct seed.

That said, from their perspective, there may be obstacles, such as inventory, seed quality of certain cultivars, etc. But calling is the only way to find out.

In the future, I would only order single cultivars. That way, this sort of mix-up can't happen.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by Billybob » September 28th, 2017, 8:53 pm

Wow I'm surprised, I never heard a bad word about Hogan Company. I would wait also.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by Ric Clint » September 28th, 2017, 9:10 pm

Wait, wait, wait... I called Hogan's 2-3 weeks ago asking for the Paramount and they told me they won't be getting any this year because it wasn't "clean" and then I asked for the Cochise IV and they said they were out of that also and it would be a week or so before they got that one so I called again 2 days ago and they said they still haven't gotten in the Cochise IV and they are hoping it will be there next week?

So I'm hearing a different story from them it sounds like?



.

Green
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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by Green » September 28th, 2017, 11:14 pm

Worst case scenario, if they refuse to replace it...you could put in a new order (for separate single cultivar bags), and then keep the first seed bag they sent you. You could use that for another project, or sell it someone (like a neighbor) at cost.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by Marinegrunt » September 29th, 2017, 12:03 am

Thanks guys. I agree Green. Calling is the best method. It's easier to work things out talking. I have been dealing with Stephen the whole time except for when I called and ordered a few days ago. Someone named Scott took the order. He took my credit card number down wrong. Supposedly they called but I didn't know that until I had emailed Stephen about the fungus. He emailed me back telling me my credit card was invalid and to call. Well, the reciept I got today shows my phone number was written down wrong. Honestly though, they have been great every time I have dealt with them. Stephen was always fast replying to emails and was always available for questions. Someone obviously wasn't paying attention during the phone call.

Anyways, I emailed and let him know I would be lying if I told him it wouldn't bother me spot seeding areas with 3 different cultivars. I feel like it would be hard not to blame them if the lawn happened to look different where I used them. Plus, it would just plain bother me spot seeding with different cultivars. I'd be out there all the time tricking myself into thinking I could notice even If I couldn't. If I had enough to spot seed and over seed I would be okay with adding 3 more. Well, it didn't take long and he emailed back. It was short and sweet but said he would get the correct seed out tomorrow. I kind of figured the first reply was a "let's try and talk him into using it".

It takes 2 days to get here via FedEx so it probably won't show until Monday or Tuesday. I should do what Hoosier recommended and demand overnight and Saturday.

Ric... my guess is they mix up a thousand pounds of their The Hogan Blend (TTTF Blend) because it's faster than doing 50-100 lbs at a time. They might be out of them individually. I wasn't sure i could get my original mix so I told them I was okay with only a few of my original cultivars for spot seeding. That's probably how he's able to fix my order.

I probably made it seem like a bigger deal posting than what it was. My original thought was if you guys said I wouldn't notice a difference I'd be okay with it. I emailed back basically saying I wasn't okay with cultivars I didn't order even if they will look the same and they said they'd fix it. Although, I probably shouldn't have had to email a second time, I'm still happy with the overall experience with Hogan Seed. Stephen has been awesome to work with.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by Marinegrunt » September 29th, 2017, 12:24 am

Green wrote:
September 28th, 2017, 11:14 pm
Worst case scenario, if they refuse to replace it...you could put in a new order (for separate single cultivar bags), and then keep the first seed bag they sent you. You could use that for another project, or sell it someone (like a neighbor) at cost.
When I ordered the seed I specifically told them I only wanted the 6 different cultivars that I originally ordered. I told them of they could only provide a couple out of those six I was okay with that. I just didn't want any new ones. One guy probably took the order and another filled it. The reciept only said The Hogan Blend + NuGlade. It didn't say anything about the cultivars mentioned. I think it was just poor communication between two people.

You read my mind. I was looking for other sources online. Luckily it sounds like they can send what I need. It will be interesting to see how many of the original 6 cultivars will be included. I'm okay with only a few of them but I'm hoping they have all 6. I know they have atleast 3 unless they are already mixed in with other cultivars I don't want.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by smast16 » September 29th, 2017, 9:32 am

Marinegrunt wrote:
September 29th, 2017, 12:03 am
Plus, it would just plain bother me spot seeding with different cultivars. I'd be out there all the time tricking myself into thinking I could notice even If I couldn't.
That's just it right there. We are ALL CRAZY here. People think our yards are beautiful, but we walk around mowing thinking how much it looks like Sh!t. Too thin here, too light colored here, the blades weren't sharpened correctly, Is that a weed??

You did the right thing MG. With as much time as you've labored and waited for the lawn YOU want, you'll be far happier that you waited.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by ken-n-nancy » September 29th, 2017, 9:39 am

smast16 wrote:
September 29th, 2017, 9:32 am
That's just it right there. We are ALL CRAZY here. People think our yards are beautiful, but we walk around mowing thinking ... too thin here, too light colored here, the blades weren't sharpened correctly, Is that a weed??
Quoted for truth!

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by seiyafan » September 29th, 2017, 9:40 am

Marinegrunt wrote:
September 29th, 2017, 12:24 am
Green wrote:
September 28th, 2017, 11:14 pm
Worst case scenario, if they refuse to replace it...you could put in a new order (for separate single cultivar bags), and then keep the first seed bag they sent you. You could use that for another project, or sell it someone (like a neighbor) at cost.
When I ordered the seed I specifically told them I only wanted the 6 different cultivars that I originally ordered. I told them of they could only provide a couple out of those six I was okay with that. I just didn't want any new ones. One guy probably took the order and another filled it. The reciept only said The Hogan Blend + NuGlade. It didn't say anything about the cultivars mentioned. I think it was just poor communication between two people.

You read my mind. I was looking for other sources online. Luckily it sounds like they can send what I need. It will be interesting to see how many of the original 6 cultivars will be included. I'm okay with only a few of them but I'm hoping they have all 6. I know they have atleast 3 unless they are already mixed in with other cultivars I don't want.
When is the average frost date at your place? The window for seeding is closing fast.

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Re: Wrong cultivars sent, what would you do?

Post by probasesteal » September 29th, 2017, 10:01 am

I'm not sure I would have added any bluegrass at this time of the year, but it may workout.

Honestly, if you can get the seed by Monday I would use the correct seed. Otherwise, I would probably just use what they sent and have 4-5 days of extra germination time. I can't tell the difference in the newer elite fescues and chances are you will probably have to use some variation of those cultivars in the future when overseeding TTTF.

The bluegrass component on the other hand, you may be able to notice the difference. However, I questions how much germination and establishment you will get seeding it now and having it compete with the TTTF seed and what is already established.

The principle of the matter is most concerning.

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