Sand and leveling

[Green]

Even with 1+ acre of lawn, I do leveling with bags of good topsoil purchased at HD/Lowes/garden centers, and not the brand name stuff mixed with fertilizers and amendments. The stuff that is all topsoil and goes for $1.50 a bag is best.

Andy, I know you're probably trying to avoid brand names in this post since they cost more...but I bought a large bag of Pennington soil recently, and the quality seemed excellent. Scotts, on the other hand, conshstently had lumps of wood, plastic, etc. I rarely buy soil, so those are the only two I've tried so far.

Also, I agree with you regarding not wanting to topdress using pure sand. Bermuda grass seems to be able to grow even on concrete...so soil quality in the upper layers for warm season grass with stolons does not seem as critical as with cool-season bunch or rhizome-forming types! Even if I wanted to decrease the TEC of upper soil layers, I would be afraid of using pure sand.

[andy10917]

I don't avoid naming brands when I think they're worth the additional cost, and when I find one that is good at a good price I say it. I was shocked to see that the (local/regional) one I buy has skyrocketed to a ridiculous $1.75.

[andy10917]

That's not the exact bag, but there are local/regionals that HD carries. That's the "no-name" idea though - and I've never found anything but topsoil in the bags (no twigs, rocks, etc).

[fun4me2]

Oh, OK. Yes, they can be a bit wet sometimes. I don't find that it affects nothing - it crumbles well when opened for me. I find it better than the brand names that include things I don't want and are either marketing gimmicks or fillers. It actually tests damned well - all of the tests that were sent to labs to pick our ST6 "preferred" lab were from the same lot of that bagged soil.

Thanks andy

BTW I did buy a bag of the "brand name" topsoil after the "cheap" one wasn't what I was expecting.
My thought was you get what you pay for....

When I opened the more expensive "name brand" topsoil bag,
I thought I had picked the wrong bag....
it looked more like mulch then soil.
I never bought any more "topsoil" after that.

Now that the topic has been discussed here, and cheap in this case is
I will attempt to try it again.
I like "cheap"

[andy10917]

I don't like what they do to topsoil with many of the brands - too much crap added - i'll add my own amendments, thanks. Give me pure topsoil (probably stolen from someone's home construction) and let me deal with it. Yes, the topsoil is probably wet to add the weight of water, but I'm more interested in the "topsoil-only" angle, and the "cheap" angle is bonus points and not my primary goal. I work with 20-25 bags or so per day when filling/leveling jobs arise (need time for mowing too!), and I don't have to figure out what to do with the remaining pile when I buy bulk - nor do I need to shovel it into the wheelbarrow and back out again.

[Chris LI]

I had to grade the area around a deck I built in August, and bought 28 bags of the "cheap" stuff (Earth Gro) and one bag of Kellogg Topper from HD. I was pleasantly surprised with the quality of the Earthgro. The Kellogg had a mix of topsoil and mulch, which wasn't for me , since I seeded and topdressed with peat moss. Andy, thanks for the suggestion from an earlier related thread, to try the "cheap" bagged topsoil.

P.S. I have two bags left which will be easy to store for winter, without becoming a "mud pile", as Andy mentioned. I'm thinking of purchasing the "levelawn" (or a knockoff), but am coming to terms with shelling out the cash.

[KingLion]

I'm trying to figure out if sand is best everywhere, when (if ever) I should use top soil (for larger areas?), and what, specifically, I should ask for if ordering yards of sand from a local company.

In general, when topdressing our soil types to even out areas, you would want some level of organic matter mixed in the sand so as not to create a soil horizon. The problem is, too much organic matter (e.g. pure compost) will not work for leveling purposes, because it will degrade to almost nothing (in terms of original volume) over time. Andy can give you good advice from the TEC of your soil test on how to mimic that soil when mixing sand and organic matter). You may want to go slightly sandier for leveling purposes, as you can always add organic matter over time (compost topdressing, leaf mulching, etc.), but you can't remove it once it's added. I would definitely recommend mixing your own soil to the specifications that make sense for the project.

For major bumps, I usually try to use a pitchfork or garden fork first, in case soil compression is what's causing the low spot. If, after a few weeks of doing this, the low spot keeps coming back or if it's impossible to get it to the right level with this method, I dig up the grass, fill with more soil (typically removing the topsoil first, and replacing it as the second to last step), and then putting the grass back. Since any soil you introduce will compress, you need to make sure it's tamped down adequately, but so much that you're over-compressing it. Otherwise, it will settle after a week or two, and you'll have to repeat the process.

Agree with that, we do we same. It's really wise to move the lawn and add a soil for good leveling