Thoughts on Fescue Reno Charlotte

[Tothemoon]

Does this sound like a game plan for fall renovation In Charlotte? Lawn typically gets a bunch Poa every year. Three weeks ago I took care of the majority of weeds with a 4oz Tenacity hit. Aeration and over seeding is scheduled for this Wednesday with storm scheduled to hit on Thursday bringing 1.5 inches of rain. Should I hold off on putting down the seed until after the storm. I have a sloped yard in the front and back, but it is not very aggressive. Or should I put half the seeds down before the storm and the other half after? My ultimate plan is to get another 4 ounce rate of tenacity down within 4 days of the seed going down. I typically get a bunch of clover growing during my annual seeding, which is why I want another round of tenacity at seeding. This rain may make me want to delay that application. After the tenacity is down I will cover the more bare spots with straw. Once all of this is buttoned down I will hit the yard with a 2 oz rate of Tenacity after my second mowing. This may be the first week of November . The thought here is that as the ground gets below 70 degrees the Poa will start to grow again. I have some of the generic Baracade that I can put down as a preemergent. When would be the best time for that? What would be the best timing for other 2 oz Tenacity hits. Spring? Any guidance is appreciated. Grass grows in Charlotte until about Christmas. Frost never kills any of my weeds.

[andy10917]

My first impression is that you're trying to do too many things in too short a period, and I also think that you're putting too much reliance on Tenacity as a general-purpose herbicide, which it isn't.

Given your timeframe, I don't see how you get to using the Barricade for Poa Annua this season. The manufacturer says Barricade is 60 days after the grass germinates. Tenacity is the best stopgap Pre-M, and its Pre-M capabilities are so-so -- it's more of a pleasant side-effect than a dedicated Pre-M, and I wouldn't expect a weed-free outcome.

Any idea as to why you always get Clover in your annual overseeds?

One last thing for clarification: you're identifying your effort as a Renovation, but the body of your posting seems to indicate an overseeding. Renovations typically involve killing all the grass you currently have and starting from scratch. Is that your plan or is this just an overseeding of an existing lawn?

[Tothemoon]

Thanks Andy. This is an over seeding that is more on the renovation front as I have a few decent areas of grass with most areas very thin to all dirt areas. I guess my thought Is to use the barricade in spring or after my grass has had plenty of time to grow. Not sure why the clover picks up in the fall during the Over seeding, but it does appear to be trend with most lawns in the area. This is why I think Tenacity at seeding would help. The yard has been scrapped and bagged in anticipation of the aeration on Wednesday. The hard work is done, which is why I am anxious for success and willing to do the work throughout the next 12 months. Not a fan of the Poa as I fear it may make up the majority of my grass.

[andy10917]

Just so I'm being transparent, I am quite anti-aeration -- unless you have mechanical compaction. I personally dumped my aerator into the rain next to the barn in 2009 to let it rot away. I don't see any reason or gain that can be identified unless you've got a golf course that has sand-based greens.

I'd do what I can in 2020, and deal with the weeds resulting in Spring 2021. Then I'd get a good soil test from Logan Labs and build the soil/grass to an improved level in Spring/Summer 2021 via our (free) plan - with a target of a Fall 2021 that eliminates this need for annual replacement. There is something wrong if annual reseeding is needed. Yes, I have KBG, but I am struggling with keeping up on the mowing of the dense, rapidly-growing stand - and that should be your target too.

[stevehollx]

Thanks Andy. This is an over seeding that is more on the renovation front as I have a few decent areas of grass with most areas very thin to all dirt areas. I guess my thought Is to use the barricade in spring or after my grass has had plenty of time to grow. Not sure why the clover picks up in the fall during the Over seeding, but it does appear to be trend with most lawns in the area. This is why I think Tenacity at seeding would help. The yard has been scrapped and bagged in anticipation of the aeration on Wednesday. The hard work is done, which is why I am anxious for success and willing to do the work throughout the next 12 months. Not a fan of the Poa as I fear it may make up the majority of my grass.

I also skip aerating now—could that be adding to your weed or Poa A problem?

I overseeded last sunday 6-Sep (also in Charlotte) and I do use Tenacity with it. Germinated in 5 days.

You can knock the clover down in April with triclopyr. Clover started popping up in my lawn in August. I hand pulled it.

If you really are on a Poa A rampage, one thing people consider is trying to alternate overseeding every other year, so you get a layer of Fall pre-em (barricade/prodiamine) to help the next year. Essentially fighting trade offs. The year you don’t overseed you may have to be more aggressive with fungicide though, but that $200 of seed goes to $200 fungicide, I guess. I’m not there yet—third year on this lawn seeding yearly but lawn held up well this summer so correcting some issues and expecting I can defer general overseeding next year for the first time, outside of inevitable dog spots.

Hiding hoses on timers was the game changer this year to prevent thinning (I also applied fungicide this year preventatively. Will continue next year as the new 2020 seeds mature). +$100/mo in water bill for the 3 hot summer months. 6k sqft lawn but also irrigating a garden and some hydrangeas.

[Tothemoon]

Looks like we have similar setup. I’m at about 6K and agree the timers help. During over seeding I run 4 in the front and 4 in the back. I did a light over seeding after aeration yesterday. I’ll let the storm pass and add some more seed on Saturday after things dry up a bit and add my Tenacity at that time. I think the biggest driver of my Poa is poor soil. Where the Poa is the greatest the soil is the most compact. Yesterday I ordered my supplies for the kelp help and the soil conditioner. So hopefully this will be my last year of aeration. Next year I’ll probably have to seed again, but maybe in year two I can hold off and try your method of alternating with barricade.