How much fertilizer should I put down now

[s1mpl3k1d]

I've already applied grub killer 2 weeks ago. I'm seeing grass poking out of the dead hay maybe every 2 feet apart. We all know that KBG is extremely good in spreading. I've witnessed it. I would like to know how much fertilizer I should put per 1000 sqft so that those grass that survived will be the super spreader?

[Masbustelo]

It is my understanding that you don't have an irrigation system. Based on that I would say the answer to your question is none. Until next Tuesday when there is a possibility of rain. If you monitor this possible rain, then you can apply immediately prior to. The amount? I"ll leave to others.

[s1mpl3k1d]

I do have an underground sprinkler irrigation system. Should I put 2 lbs of urea per 1k sqft?

[bpgreen]

I think the role of thumb is to apply enough that you get 1 lb of actual N per 1000 Sq ft. The amounts of N, P, and K in fertilizer are shown as percentages. For example, a balanced fertilizer might be 10-10-10. So that would have 10% N. I think urea is 46-0-0. I think I've seen it in a different form that is 39-0-0.

To get the amount to apply, divide 100 by the amount of N on the bag. 100÷46 is about 2.17. I think you'd be fine rounding that to 2.

If the N number on the bag is 39, you'd probably want to use 2.5 lbs per 1000 sq ft.

[s1mpl3k1d]

Awesome! Thanks for the formula. I have 46-0-0. Thanks a lot!

[MorpheusPA]

Just hold off on that until just before rain. Otherwise, you risk off-gassing the nitrogen to the atmosphere, at least in part, and burning the grasses that are exposed to it, at least a little.

Once again, I'm reduced to standing outside, shaking a fist at the sky. It looks like the next rainfall will be some back-blow from Delta after it finishes with the Gulf. It's October 8th and still with this late August weather, we are. Yuck.

[s1mpl3k1d]

Just hold off on that until just before rain. Otherwise, you risk off-gassing the nitrogen to the atmosphere, at least in part, and burning the grasses that are exposed to it, at least a little.

Even if I water it right away?

[falcon]

No, if you water it in that is fine. I think Morpheus forgot you have irrigation.

[andy10917]

I'm seeing grass poking out of the dead hay maybe every 2 feet apart. We all know that KBG is extremely good in spreading. I've witnessed it. I would like to know how much fertilizer I should put per 1000 sqft so that those grass that survived will be the super spreader?

If I take your statement literally, that's an enormous leap of faith to expect grass that's one plant every 2 ft apart to turn back into a lawn through spreading. Many years. Of course, there's always a bit of hope that there is still some grass that is dormant and not dead, but if that's not the case then you'll have your hands full trying to keep weeds from filling in the spaces between the grass plants that are remaining.

[s1mpl3k1d]

No, if you water it in that is fine. I think Morpheus forgot you have irrigation.

Gotcha!

If I take your statement literally, that's an enormous leap of faith to expect grass that's one plant every 2 ft apart to turn back into a lawn through spreading. Many years. Of course, there's always a bit of hope that there is still some grass that is dormant and not dead, but if that's not the case then you'll have your hands full trying to keep weeds from filling in the spaces between the grass plants that are remaining.

Got it. I forgot that I can drop seeds again. I'm pretty some of the failures on my lawn this year was my fault. Lawn was beautiful until mid-July. Grass might have already been stressed due to lack of rain and maybe near end of July, I may have sprayed Tenacity and Barricade. I should start making a log. Another thing I should have done was application of preventative insect killers. I saw tons of Japanese Beetles in my area yet I didn't do anything. It's because it was never part of my routine. I never applied anything since day 1 moved to this house. I promised to my lawn that next year around late May or early June, I will put Scotts GrubX as a preventative measure. I bought Sevin yesterday since it was on sale. I can use it as a post insect/grubs killer next year.

I need to find and print out a good KGB regimen for a whole year. I don't have one at the moment. I normally would just buy soybean meal and milo then drop them around mid May.Then I apply another fert in early September. Finally starting Oct, I spread 1 lbs of 46-0-0 urea every week. This was my schedule before. I'm honestly not sure if it is proper regimen for a KBG lawn.

[MorpheusPA]

Yep, irrigation handles that issue nicely.

[s1mpl3k1d]

Yep, irrigation handles that issue nicely.

Awesome! I did it yesterday!

I finally understand how much nitrogen is put based on the the weight we are spreading in a 1,000 sqft lawn. I learned from this link how much nitrogen a grass needs per year. It's also important to know which grass type we're dealing with - https://www.dummies.com/home-garden/law ... your-lawn/

For KBG, it's 4-6 lbs of nitrogen per year. For tall fescue, it's 2-6 lbs of nitrogen this year.

That means, if we are going to be applying 46-0-0 urea and we are targeting to put 1 pound of nitrogen on a 1,000 sqft area, the weight of urea we need to put in our spreader is 2.2 lbs. That's only for 1 application. That means, we have to do 5 more application on different dates. I don't know what those dates are. Bpgreen's formula was also correct and example was very helpful!

I guess it's very bad if we put 6 lbs of nitrogen in one application. It might smother/kill the grass. Do you agree though with the amount of nitrogen required per year written in the link I posted?

[MorpheusPA]

Approximately. One year, I went test organic and applied 30 pounds of nitrogen. The lawn glowed. Don't try that synthetically, it'll sterilize the soil by salting it, but doing so organically, there's no realistic upper limit of nitrogen you can apply or that the lawn can "use," although you do lose some to the air as nitrogen compounds (AKA "stink"). I tried to keep that to a minimum by hauling a boat-ton of corn.

For synthetics, I tend (on my lawn) to limit things to 1 pound fast release maximum, while managing the slow-release curves in my head such that the top bell of the curves won't ever reach a point where they'll damage the lawn when combined with any fast-release nitrogen in the loop. If that presents a mathematical challenge, it's wiser not to use slow-release nitrogen.

At this point of the year, I'm at almost exactly 5 pounds of nitrogen on my bluegrass lawn. Let's see if I can copy this part of the chart out...

05/16/20 0.50 Organic
05/25/20 0.64 Synthetic

08/01/20 0.85 Organic
09/01/20 1.43 Organic + Synthetic (some slow release)
10/01/20 1.56 Organic + Synthetic (some slow release)

That's in pounds of nitrogen. You'll note I went well over a pound both in September and October, but the organic fraction and the slow release fraction won't flood the lawn and aren't going to be an issue.

There's one more application to go, just about the time growth stops. November 15th? Who knows? That'll be a drop of about 1 pound fast-release N, with considerable iron and slow-release N because...Pennsylvania. Winters are a distant memory and my lawn will be green into February anyway.

Call it just about 6 pounds N total, with an additional half pound slow release available during warmer periods during winter when the grass is actively green (always) and growing (slowly all through winter anyway, by March it needs a mow).

If I were designing a pure synthetic program, or a spoon feed, I'd do things very differently. In my case, I also have to play the weather, and work with differing seasons. This was a dry one, and an oddball due to COVID.

[s1mpl3k1d]

Thanks a lot for sharing your log as well as the way you spread it out. That will really help me a lot! I will print it and stick it on my wall.

I noticed you didn't apply anything in the month of June and July. Cool!

[MorpheusPA]

Nope, nothing. Ever, really. And that urea drop in May was odd, and only because I didn't have the organics to drop in May--I would normally never do that, and would make May's application completely organic.

For that matter, August would have had more in the way of organics as well, but I worked with what I had (and never, never a synthetic in August around here). September would, most years, be pure organics. October...likely organic, but might include some synthetic depending. November, 100% synthetic as it's too cold for organics.

COVID borked my applications, but the dates are pretty solid for me, barring really odd rainfall. Delta's due in on Monday with showers, some heavy, so I just mowed and jettisoned a quarter of the gardens into the lawn as they're done for the season. It's...many?...pounds of free, uncounted organics as I have 2,000 square feet of garden.

[s1mpl3k1d]

Nope, nothing. Ever, really. And that urea drop in May was odd, and only because I didn't have the organics to drop in May--I would normally never do that, and would make May's application completely organic.

For that matter, August would have had more in the way of organics as well, but I worked with what I had (and never, never a synthetic in August around here). September would, most years, be pure organics. October...likely organic, but might include some synthetic depending. November, 100% synthetic as it's too cold for organics.

COVID borked my applications, but the dates are pretty solid for me, barring really odd rainfall. Delta's due in on Monday with showers, some heavy, so I just mowed and jettisoned a quarter of the gardens into the lawn as they're done for the season. It's...many?...pounds of free, uncounted organics as I have 2,000 square feet of garden.

You're lucky, you can still get organic grains. I've searched for feed stores since April since my-goto-feed-store closed due to covid. The place where I bought the 50 lbs of urea last month does not sell any organic grains, bummer. There's a store at Elburn, I think it had "coop" in the name. I couldn't find them anymore. I used to buy four 50 lbs bags of cgm. Price was awesome back then, year 2007. It was around $12+. Few years later, looks like these feed stores learned from us, they increased the price too $40+! Damn! I really like the effect of cgm on my lawn. 2 months ago, my neighbor came over and asked the yellow-orange stuff I spread because he remembers how gorgeous my lawn was. I hope I can find a local feed store even if it's a 1.5-2hr drive from Huntley, IL.

[s1mpl3k1d]

I found ElburnCoop. I contacted them. They don't sell cgm anymore. That's weird.
I found another store in Saint Charles, CGM for $29. Still too much but way better than $46 from 2-3 years ago

[MorpheusPA]

CGM is ridiculous for the most part anyway. Cracked corn should be more economical, although not much of a feeding at 1.6% nitrogen. Soy at 7% is much better for that!

[Tarank]

2lbs/k urea. Waiting a few days to do a second spray with triclopyr

[s1mpl3k1d]

I have another question. I'm wondering why 1 lb of nitrogen per 1,000 sqft is always used per single application. If we're targeting 4-6lbs a year, will there be any difference in the plans shown below? Is it because Plan A will most likely burn the lawn?

+++++++
Plan A
+++++++
April - 3 lbs of N per 1000 sqft
September - 3 lbs of N per 1000 sqft

vs

++++++
Plan B
+++++++

April - 1lb of N per 1000 sqft
May - 1lb of N per 1000 sqft
September - 1lb of N per 1000 sqft
October - 1lb of N per 1000 sqft
November - 2lb of N per 1000 sqft