Need opinions for methods on full reno

[jjldh91]

Hi all,

I’m new to this and have been researching like crazy to come up with a game plan. My front yard was about 30% weeds, 10% bare, and 60% non uniform grass. I decided to go with a full kill using glyphosate, followed by scalping with the lawn mower, and now watering to encourage any remaining seeds to emerge so I may kill them as well. I will be applying tenacity and seeding a top quality grass of 90% tall fescue 10% KBG. I am torn between a few options for preparation…

A. Rent a soil conditioner (Harley rake) to clean up soil, level better, and remove rocks. Then seed with broadcaster and yard roller.
Cost: $500.

B. Rent a power rake to loosen soil a little and remove more thatch. (though it doesn’t appear to be that bad) Then broadcast seed and roll.
Cost: $100.

C. Rent a power seeder and go over ground a couple times to loosen soil, then add seed and sow into ground.
Cost: $100.

This project is for 2500 square feet. I’m leaning towards option C but please tell me if I’m wrong. 90% of the ground had vegetation before kill so if I’m thinking correctly, the soil should be good as it is to grow new grass seed. Pictures are attached. Thank you!

[MorpheusPA]

Insufficient data for a vote. How badly off-level and rocky is your lawn? If really badly, I'd actually recommend a professional (or a good amateur) with a box blade to even it out.

If not very, pick out the surface rocks and go with Option C.

Normally, I'd say it's rather late, but in TN, you still have time. A little time. Less than you think, actually--move quickly. Fall is coming fast, even down there. The seeding window is already closing in Pennsylvania, and that line sweeps south at least fifty miles per day.

[Masbustelo]

I vote D, neither a power rake or a power seeder. Save the $100, hand rake the thatch and sow the seed on the dirt, cover with peat moss or compost. If you have hollows, depressions or holes, fill them in with top soil and drag with a simple homemade or borrowed drag.

[jjldh91]

Insufficient data for a vote. How badly off-level and rocky is your lawn? If really badly, I'd actually recommend a professional (or a good amateur) with a box blade to even it out.

If not very, pick out the surface rocks and go with Option C.

Normally, I'd say it's rather late, but in TN, you still have time. A little time. Less than you think, actually--move quickly. Fall is coming fast, even down there. The seeding window is already closing in Pennsylvania, and that line sweeps south at least fifty miles per day.

Thank you for your advice. I probably better go ahead and do something this weekend. Sorry I didn’t provide that much data. Just moved in here a few months ago. Little to no surface rocks and fairly level. (I zero turn mow it on high speed with no problem)

[jjldh91]

I vote D, neither a power rake or a power seeder. Save the $100, hand rake the thatch and sow the seed on the dirt, cover with peat moss or compost. If you have hollows, depressions or holes, fill them in with top soil and drag with a simple homemade or borrowed drag.

Hmm… curious to why you wouldn’t power seed? Is it something that could negatively affect my lawn or is it more about saving the $100 to you?

[Masbustelo]

Unless you are cutting through dead turf, I can't see the need to power seed.

[jjldh91]

Unless you are cutting through dead turf, I can't see the need to power seed.

I understand. Thanks for the advice.

[Eradicator]

FWIW- I took a space actually worse than that, two years ago mid-Sept, ran a 60 buck bag of Scotts 16-0-0 triple on top of pure seed, then covered with peat.....water for 12 days in a row, grass after 6. I kept it alive until my trees dumped their oak leaves which sat there till my guy comes out in Nov to remove. Come Spring, wow, just wow!

good luck with your decision.

jeff

[Eradicator]

I should have added my 2nd method....same deal with the toppings, 3way, seed, peat.....but then let it "cook" under the sun after a 2 minute spray just to lock the peat into place. Let it sit for 3-4 days then water............I got grass this year in 5 days using this method where I had a 5'x20'x5' hole dug last year so I could repair a retaining wall and add a steel reinforced wall behind it.

These pics...1st one taken after 5 days. As you can see, I didn't do anything "special" but I have lots of new grass showing itself.

I just took the last two pics for you guys, after 10 days after planting last Sunday.








jeff

[MorpheusPA]

Yeah, you can power seed or not. I never did. With fairly level and few surface rocks, you certainly don't need to do so, and it sounds like little prep is necessary. Let it rip, top dress with peat or compost (1/4" maximum) and water three times daily. Hope you don't get a hurricane....

[jjldh91]

I should have added my 2nd method....same deal with the toppings, 3way, seed, peat.....but then let it "cook" under the sun after a 2 minute spray just to lock the peat into place. Let it sit for 3-4 days then water............I got grass this year in 5 days using this method where I had a 5'x20'x5' hole dug last year so I could repair a retaining wall and add a steel reinforced wall behind it.

These pics...1st one taken after 5 days. As you can see, I didn't do anything "special" but I have lots of new grass showing itself.

I just took the last two pics for you guys, after 10 days after planting last Sunday.








jeff

Jeff,

Thank you for your input. Glad to see such success with limited work. I need to act pretty quickly so I will most likely go with the least intensive route.

[jjldh91]

Can someone elaborate on the importance of peat moss? Doing the math, it seems that I’ll spend more money in peat moss for 2500 square feet at a quarter inch than I spent on the actual seed itself.

[DevilDawg81]

Peat helps keep the seed from drying out, provides some protection, does not introduce weed seeds like straw…and there’s probably more I’m not thinking of. 2500 sq ft, yes that may be a lot of peat moss. I’ve used peat where I can for renovations and it’s great. I’ve done some renovations over the last 2 years and they’re 10k sq ft and straw is more economical for me.

[Masbustelo]

If you have access to bulk compost from your city it is probably much less expensive than peat moss.

[Eradicator]

Yes, DD is correct on the pros of using it but it's not cheap like it used to be!!! Peat cost me 11.78 per bundle. My GF Kerry has an erosion problem so we're pricing up erosion mats...embedded with grass seed. Without seed, 2000SF costs 250 bucks at Lowes....23 bucks per 4'x50' mat. Might be a cheaper solution...???

Last year I bought ten bags and as mentioned, I ran out halfway across my front yard.....as it really doesn't go very far....and you'll never get it to 1/4" unless you use a duster-barrel with holes. Do the best you can and it helps to believe in God.....

jeff

[MorpheusPA]

Believe in Allah but tie up your camel. Topdress with something, whether that's compost or peat moss. You'll find both kind of spendy, the compost either in terms of cost, or in terms of what you get (city compost, often times, which is of questionable status and often contains weed seeds). Our local city compost is so bad it kills plants. Yours, hopefully, is better.

I used peat moss. It cost a fair clip, but it was worth it.

[jjldh91]

Thank you everyone for your input and advice. I’ve narrowed it down to making a decision and am going to pull the trigger pretty quick now. I had a reputable pro come out and look at the yard. They recommended to just aerate and broadcast seed. One last question if anyone could chime in on advice. If choosing one over the other, would you…

A. Power seed with machine without any prior aeration.

Or

B. Core aerate the lawn and broadcast seed as recommended.

Thank you all, you’ve been beyond helpful!

[MorpheusPA]

I'd prolly just broadcast with no prep because that's exactly what I did. Aeration is not only not required, it's a disadvantage. Most pros recommend it because it earns them a few bucks. It actually does very little to help anything.

[jjldh91]

I'd prolly just broadcast with no prep because that's exactly what I did. Aeration is not only not required, it's a disadvantage. Most pros recommend it because it earns them a few bucks. It actually does very little to help anything.

Morpheus, I did some more research on what you said. Wow I never even thought about it. How is seed going to germinate and cover a yard well when buried in a 4 inch hole? It’s probably not. I think I’ll skip the aeration for sure.

[MorpheusPA]

Exactly. Seed can grow through about a quarter inch of soil or other covering, tops. Not four inches. Seed is also entirely capable of driving that root through anything up to and including a heavy clay soil (which you do not have). Grasses grow on the Great Plains, where the soil is solid, rained on twice a year, subject to buffalo herds and whatnot, and it does fine. Your lawn, coddled and watered, is not exactly a challenge of significant proportions.

This is what a decently-treated lawn looks like--and I've fallen down on the job lately. I'm just picking up the load again.