Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Kentucky bluegrass, Fescue, Rye and Bent, etc
Post Reply
Green
Posts: 6837
Joined: September 14th, 2012, 10:53 pm
Location: CT (Zone 6B)
Grass Type: KBG, TTTF, TTPR, and FF (various mixtures)
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Experienced

Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by Green » November 2nd, 2012, 9:53 pm

So, I overseeded 8-10 weeks ago, and it's pretty thick now but the roots are very shallow. I put down 2/3 rate of an ap of synthetic starter fertilizer about 4 weeks after seeding. 2 weeks after that, I put down about 1/4 to 1/2 rate of an ap of Milorganite. About 2-3 weeks after that, I put down the second 2/3 rate ap of synthetic starter, which brings us to this past week (the last area to be seeded area just got its second application of starter a few days ago, while the other area has gone at least two, maybe three weeks without any fertilizer).

How many more 1/4, 1/3, or 1/2 rate aps of Milorganite would you use this year, and how would you space them out? Also, is there anything else I should be considering using this Fall considering a lot of the grass is new and not well rooted yet?

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by andy10917 » November 2nd, 2012, 9:56 pm

I think that you're at the tail-end of the Milorganite season right now in CT.

Green
Posts: 6837
Joined: September 14th, 2012, 10:53 pm
Location: CT (Zone 6B)
Grass Type: KBG, TTTF, TTPR, and FF (various mixtures)
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Experienced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by Green » November 2nd, 2012, 9:59 pm

andy10917 wrote:I think that you're at the tail-end of the Milorganite season right now in CT.
Really? You mean adding more won't do much good beyond the next couple of weeks??? I don't know that the grass has gotten enough N (and K and P) yet to handle the winter.

What should I be doing the next month or so?

HanLawn
Posts: 3226
Joined: March 6th, 2011, 7:27 pm
Location: frederick,maryland
Grass Type: COCHISE IV,FALCON V,FAITH TTTF + KBG
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by HanLawn » November 2nd, 2012, 10:05 pm

winterize.

Green
Posts: 6837
Joined: September 14th, 2012, 10:53 pm
Location: CT (Zone 6B)
Grass Type: KBG, TTTF, TTPR, and FF (various mixtures)
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Experienced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by Green » November 2nd, 2012, 10:08 pm

HanLawn wrote:winterize.
Best way to do that?


User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by andy10917 » November 2nd, 2012, 10:08 pm

Your question indicates that you don't understand the differences in how the processes work for synthetics and Milorganite (or any other organic sources).

Synthetics supply ready-to-use nutrients. Organics require an active microherd, which will not be active much longer as the temperatures fall. Time is running out.

Green
Posts: 6837
Joined: September 14th, 2012, 10:53 pm
Location: CT (Zone 6B)
Grass Type: KBG, TTTF, TTPR, and FF (various mixtures)
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Experienced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by Green » November 2nd, 2012, 10:21 pm

andy10917 wrote:Your question indicates that you don't understand the differences in how the processes work for synthetics and Milorganite (or any other organic sources).

Synthetics supply ready-to-use nutrients. Organics require an active microherd, which will not be active much longer as the temperatures fall. Time is running out.
Andy-- So at this point, it sounds like more synthetics are needed before winter. Ok, I've done my starter, and I'm being told to winterize soon. Is this good advice for newly planted grass? And why is it good advice? What does winterizing really do, and how is the best way to do it in my specific case (what, when, how much)? Also, anything else necessary/recommended to do/apply between now and when I do the winterizer?

GaryCinChicago
Posts: 6332
Joined: January 31st, 2009, 10:04 pm
Location: Chicago, IL.
Grass Type: KBG
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by GaryCinChicago » November 2nd, 2012, 10:35 pm

Green wrote: . Is this good advice for newly planted grass? And why is it good advice? What does winterizing really do, and how is the best way to do it in my specific case (what, when, how much)? Also, anything else necessary/recommended to do/apply between now and when I do the winterizer?
Green, have you tried the forum's search feature?

http://aroundtheyard.com/northern/fyi-w ... t2899.html

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by andy10917 » November 2nd, 2012, 10:37 pm

First I'll answer your question - yes, synthetics will be the right (and only practical) answer in roughly another week or so.

Second, we need to explain the difference between what you'll see as "winterizer" on this site and "winterizer" in the stores. It is a high-Nitrogen late-season (AFTER the top growth stops) treatment for us, and a very different product in the stores. The benefits of the store-stuff were disproven years ago, but they keep making it because consumers will buy it.

Green
Posts: 6837
Joined: September 14th, 2012, 10:53 pm
Location: CT (Zone 6B)
Grass Type: KBG, TTTF, TTPR, and FF (various mixtures)
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Experienced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by Green » November 2nd, 2012, 10:39 pm

GaryCinChicago wrote:
Green wrote: . Is this good advice for newly planted grass? And why is it good advice? What does winterizing really do, and how is the best way to do it in my specific case (what, when, how much)? Also, anything else necessary/recommended to do/apply between now and when I do the winterizer?
Green, have you tried the forum's search feature?

http://aroundtheyard.com/northern/fyi-w ... t2899.html
Yes, but there is still conflicting information and questions left unanswered...true winterizer versus winterizer...new vs established lawns and winterizing...downsides, if any of winterizing, etc.

I'm looking to be assured by you guys that winterizing new grass is really the best thing to do.

And the big one...why quick release? I don't get it. Doesn't quick release cause excessive topgrowth as soon as the plant starts to grow again?

Green
Posts: 6837
Joined: September 14th, 2012, 10:53 pm
Location: CT (Zone 6B)
Grass Type: KBG, TTTF, TTPR, and FF (various mixtures)
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Experienced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by Green » November 2nd, 2012, 10:41 pm

andy10917 wrote:First I'll answer your question - yes, synthetics will be the right (and only practical) answer in roughly another week or so.

Second, we need to explain the difference between what you'll see as "winterizer" on this site and "winterizer" in the stores. It is a high-Nitrogen late-season (AFTER the top growth stops) treatment for us, and a very different product in the stores. The benefits of the store-stuff were disproven years ago, but they keep making it because consumers will buy it.
Yeah, that's why I'm so confused at this point. It's apples to oranges.

So Andy...what should I do between now and "then" (whenever topgrowth stops, I guess) as far as fertilizer goes, if anything? I could do another bit of organic (Milo) tomorrow...or not. And synthetics? Do I need another ap in between the starter and winterizer? If so, what sort of fertilizer am I looking for?

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by andy10917 » November 2nd, 2012, 10:45 pm

And the big one...why quick release? I don't get it. Doesn't quick release cause excessive topgrowth as soon as the plant starts to grow again?
No. Once top-growth has stopped, the Nitrogen will be moved to nutrient storage in the plant's roots, which remain active for a while (weeeks) after the top growth tops. It has the advantage that when the plant wakes up in the Spring, it is fertilized without you fertilizing every weed that it trying to get a start in the Spring.

Green
Posts: 6837
Joined: September 14th, 2012, 10:53 pm
Location: CT (Zone 6B)
Grass Type: KBG, TTTF, TTPR, and FF (various mixtures)
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Experienced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by Green » November 2nd, 2012, 10:57 pm

andy10917 wrote:
And the big one...why quick release? I don't get it. Doesn't quick release cause excessive topgrowth as soon as the plant starts to grow again?
No. Once top-growth has stopped, the Nitrogen will be moved to nutrient storage in the plant's roots, which remain active for a while (weeeks) after the top growth tops. It has the advantage that when the plant wakes up in the Spring, it is fertilized without you fertilizing every weed that it trying to get a start in the Spring.
Makes sense. So, what do you all recommend for a quick and easy source of obtaining the Winterizer? And supposedly it's super flammable (explosive), so I guess I don't want extra leftover in the basement over winter. And, what am I looking for on a fertilizer label? Urea? All Nitrogen and nothing else? Is this stuff hard to find? Maybe a trip to Lesco (never been there before) might be in order, if Home Depot and Agway and Ace hardware or the local garden centers don't carry it.

Oh, and does ap rate of Winterizer differ for young grass versus mature?

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by andy10917 » November 2nd, 2012, 11:03 pm

Pure Urea (46-0-0) is the best. Beyond that, any fertilizer with a a high "N" (first) number in a fast-release form, applied to supply about 1 lb of Nitrogen per 1000 sq ft. None are explosive.

Green
Posts: 6837
Joined: September 14th, 2012, 10:53 pm
Location: CT (Zone 6B)
Grass Type: KBG, TTTF, TTPR, and FF (various mixtures)
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Experienced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by Green » November 2nd, 2012, 11:27 pm

andy10917 wrote:Pure Urea (46-0-0) is the best. Beyond that, any fertilizer with a a high "N" (first) number in a fast-release form, applied to supply about 1 lb of Nitrogen per 1000 sq ft. None are explosive.
Should be "findable" this time of year. Now, what's your opinion on one more mini dose of organic (Milo) tomorrow? We've been right around 50 degrees +/- 5 during the day, and will be dipping into the high 20s at night in a few days.

User avatar
andy10917
Posts: 29739
Joined: February 23rd, 2009, 10:48 pm
Location: NY (Lower Hudson Valley)
Grass Type: Emblem KBG (Front); Blueberry KBG Monostand (Back)
Lawn Size: 1 acre-2 acre
Level: Advanced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by andy10917 » November 2nd, 2012, 11:29 pm

The soil temperature is more important than the air temperature, but you should get away with one more if it's tomorrow.

Green
Posts: 6837
Joined: September 14th, 2012, 10:53 pm
Location: CT (Zone 6B)
Grass Type: KBG, TTTF, TTPR, and FF (various mixtures)
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Experienced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by Green » November 2nd, 2012, 11:44 pm

andy10917 wrote:The soil temperature is more important than the air temperature, but you should get away with one more if it's tomorrow.
Very well, then. Thanks, Andy.

mattya
Posts: 4179
Joined: May 22nd, 2012, 9:24 am
Location: Southeast MA
Grass Type: Bewitched, Prosperity, Moonlight SLT
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by mattya » November 3rd, 2012, 10:20 am

Green wrote:Yes, but there is still conflicting information and questions left unanswered...true winterizer versus winterizer...new vs established lawns and winterizing...downsides, if any of winterizing, etc.

I'm looking to be assured by you guys that winterizing new grass is really the best thing to do.

And the big one...why quick release? I don't get it. Doesn't quick release cause excessive topgrowth as soon as the plant starts to grow again?
I'm just curious - Where on this forum did you find conflicting information or possible downsides of winterizing?

Green
Posts: 6837
Joined: September 14th, 2012, 10:53 pm
Location: CT (Zone 6B)
Grass Type: KBG, TTTF, TTPR, and FF (various mixtures)
Lawn Size: 10000-20000
Level: Experienced

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by Green » November 3rd, 2012, 5:13 pm

mattya wrote:
Green wrote:Yes, but there is still conflicting information and questions left unanswered...true winterizer versus winterizer...new vs established lawns and winterizing...downsides, if any of winterizing, etc.

I'm looking to be assured by you guys that winterizing new grass is really the best thing to do.

And the big one...why quick release? I don't get it. Doesn't quick release cause excessive topgrowth as soon as the plant starts to grow again?
I'm just curious - Where on this forum did you find conflicting information or possible downsides of winterizing?
The conflict was in "True Winterizer" versus "commercial Winterizer". Apparently some have used "commercial winterizer". And the potential downsides were just something I was wondering myself.

User avatar
sc4dr
Posts: 1263
Joined: August 4th, 2011, 8:49 pm
Location: Lutherville, Timonium, MD
Grass Type: Blueberry / Bewitched KBG - Bullseye, Hemi, Magellan TTTF
Lawn Size: Not Specified
Level: Not Specified

Re: Recommended Fall Fertilizing schedule for new lawn?

Post by sc4dr » November 4th, 2012, 12:44 am

It should all make sense by next year Green.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 26 guests