First time lawn owner, first time poster... (lawn story)

[Sixohh]

Hello all, been reading for a little while and figured i would dive right in!

new house, 1 acre in hockey ,TX the house sat for a year on the market in the texas drought last summer.

moved in, dug a small pond and used the fill dirt (mostly a hard clay) to level the back yard. i realized the soil i used for the back yard was a real mistake.

to make a short story long i bought a pallet of st. Augustine from a local dealer and laid it out right in the middle of the property. i aerated the soil first and laid down some 15-15-15 time release. before the at. Augustine could even root i had what i believe to be Bermuda take over the dirt in ma matter of 2-3 months. at first i was happy to just have mowable grass rather than dirt in the back yard. now i have 25 % st. A and 75% Bermuda? is this infact bermuda and what is the good and bad of it in my part of texas?

i mow the St. A high ( almost 3") and the Bermuda(?) gets mowed at the same height. among the things i have read i know i have a crab grass problem, i also have bahia (which i am allergic to) and dollar weed in the mix.
I mow about 1x a week and water almost every night for 15-25 mins per zone while it has been hot. this is enough to saturate well in my area.

now for the eye candy....

My house when i closed on it (i have been working my butt off since then)


after a home made harrow behind my ATV and dropping several trees....



my pallet of St. A and a view of the pond i made in the back...



and here is the grass that has completely taken over my yard. not saying its bad, just want to know more about it....






sorry about the quality of the last 4 pics. night time+ camera phone + dew on the grass.


i guess what i am asking is will this grass eventually choke out any of my weeds, how should it be watered and should i mow it at a separate level than the St. A?
i am also concerned about the thatch as seen in the above pic.

Thanks again everyone.

[Jim59]

I'm kinda new too, but let me be the first to say welcome to this very trustworthy site. Your situation is far from typical as you know. But again, you're where you need to be with much patience.

[Dave76]

Yes, that's Bermuda. My guess is that it was (at one time) a Bermuda lawn. When you scraped the surface, all the root were below ground and regrew. The good thing about Bermuda is that it's hard to kill and won't die out on you if you don't water during the hot summer. The bad news about Bermuda is that it's hard to kill if you want a St Augustine lawn.

If you want St. Augustine, I'd get out there right now and Round Up the Bermuda. Of course, don't spray your St Augustine sod. It won't look very good but the Bermuda will be going dormant in the near future anyway. Either way, you're looking at a brown lawn over the winter. Once you've killed as much Bermuda as possible, you'll need more St Augustine sod.

With all those trees, I think St Augustine is your better option.

[Sixohh]

thanks for the welcome jim. im the type of guy who values a good forum. and i always spread the knowledge where i can. im more of a diesel racer/ atv mechanic/ oilfield trash if you get my drift!

dave, the picture is kind of deceiving but if you look at the second pic, that was taken very late in the evening. that entire area and to the left of where the picture stops gets full sun from about 10 am to 6 pm.

also, i need to clear something up. i have NO problem with bermuda. if i would have known it was going to cover ground so fast i would have never spent the 100 bucks on the St A sod.

with that being said i need to pick my battles i guess. i really dont care if i have half and half of each grass as long as i dont have the weeds next season.
will one take over the other eventually? i know, i know i need to get on the ball and do a soil sample!

[flutemama]

I too am a noobie, but from what I've learned you treat the grass you want to encourage, so if it's SA then mow high, if you want bermuda, mow low. I have a mutt front that I'm going to let SA take over, mowing high and not worrying too much about the bermuda. My problem is not enough sun. The bermuda is thin and looks like crap. I've also read that you can fertilize only the SA to encourage take over. If you mow SA low in Texas heat (as I did) it will die, it also seems a bit more picky than common bermuda and easier to kill. As far as no weeds next year maybe someone more experienced can tell us if it's safe to do pre-em on sod (or newly spread bermuda). I'm doubting that one though, probably just post-em. I'm telling you, this site is awesome and so are the people.

[ckone]

tell us if it's safe to do pre-em on sod (or newly spread bermuda). I'm doubting that one though, probably just post-em.

Pre em stops seeds from starting. Should not hurt sod.

[Sixohh]

thanks for the intel and yes, ive heard that before as well. i have plenty of sun and the bermuda is thriving but the SA needs constant water not to burn (at least the last 2 months it did).

the SA i sodded has zero weed problems. nothing can get thru it. all my weeds are in the currently thin bermuda. thats where i want to improve.

so i wait till spring with the pre- emergent? i am told i can kill the crab grass with baking soda but i haven't jumped on the ball yet.

today i tried something new... i mowed the SA high (3" as normal) then i went everywhere else with a second cut on 1.5". it made the bermuda look way better and more uniformed than in the past. my 3" cut wasn't hardly clipping the top it seems.

it looks like it scalped it in some places but i think its been growing tall from my previous cuts. i assume this will green over with time?

[Sixohh]

here's a shot of my cutting low for the first time.



sharpened my rotary mulching blades today and was very happy. should have done it months ago!

[flutemama]

What about bermuda that's just spread. I just bought Amaze and it says not to put it on lawn that was recently seeded (or even spring for lawns that were seeded the past fall) so it sounds like they expect a lawn to establish a full year before using the product. I ask because my neighbor seeded bermuda in the spring and it's spread to my side and I'd love to be able to put pre-em on it (I have tons of weeds there that I keep spraying with WBG and I'm sure there are an incredible amount of weed seeds waiting to germinate). Maybe the OP can use a pre-em?

[Sixohh]

thats a good question. literally ALL the bermuda you see in my last pics has grown in the last 3 months. it was all fresh dirt. all i have done is areate and put down triple 15 to get me started. i cant complain for 3 months wort of work!

[Dave76]

With proper care and enough sun, the Bermuda can be just as thick and weed free as the St Augustine. You may have enough sun in the middle of the lawn but as you get near the trees, the Bermuda will always be thin. That's one reason why I thought the St Augustine would be the better choice.

You can certainly have a mixed lawn. One problem you'll face is that Bermuda likes to be cut low and St Augustine likes to be cut high. If you cut high enough for the St Augustine, it's too high for Bermuda and it won't get as thick as it needs to be to choke out the weeds.

Whatever you decide, I'd put out pre-emergent right now. The fall application is for the winter weeds. Next spring, put out some pre-m for crabgrass and other grassy weeds. The pre-m will eliminate many of your weed problems before they even happen. I'm not a St Augustine expert but I can guarantee you won't hurt that Bermuda with a pre-m.

[gtnike]

It doesn't look like anyone has said this, so I'll chime in - Have you read the bermuda bible yet?

Outside of that, everythgin else really depends on what you want out of your lawn. Do you want a lawn that makes cars on the street slow down? Or do you just want a consistent green color that doesn't include weeds? Based on what I've read of your post thus far, I would say let the bermuda thrive. It looks like you've got common bermuda which isn't the best grass but it isn't the worst either. St Augustine will require more maintenece (water/fertilizer) than bermuda and the only way the st augustine will take over the bermuda is if you kill off the bermuda.

So what do you want out of a lawn? The best lawn? Or just a nice lawn?

[Sixohh]

gt, im glad you asked that. ive never really thought about it.... i dont care to have the best looking lawn. i dont live in a neighborhood not can ppl see my yard from the street. i am an active person. i drive my diesel truck and atv's on the lawn almost every other day. i dont care about every spot being perfect, like stated above i just want a weed free lawn that is only 1 or 2 types of grasses total. not 4 grasses and 12 types of weeds.

i have no complaints from the bermuda, actually the more it thickens up, the more i like it. one thing i have more than others is time! i can mow, fert or aerate whenever i want.


the only problem i have now is even if i kill the SA (which i worked so hard on) it was sodded of course and it has a obviously higher elevation that the rest of the yard. i dont like it. so if i scalp it, or kill it it will still look odd without some dirt work right?

correct me if im wrong but i was always under the impression that SA would choke everything out if kept watered well and on a good fert. schedule. no?

[Sixohh]

It doesn't look like anyone has said this, so I'll chime in - Have you read the bermuda bible yet?

ill look that up!

[Dchall_San_Antonio]

The Bermuda Bible is in our articles on the home page. Articles or FAQ? I can't remember which.

With the trees in Magnolia you're going to have to learn to like the bermuda/St Aug mix. Bermuda wants to have no trees, fences, or buildings between it and the horizon. I'm surprised to see you have that much. Near the trees you'll only have St Aug. Out in the middle of the sun you'll have a strong mix of both.

St Aug is easy to kill if you want to. Just stop watering it. The bermuda will survive and return as quickly as you saw it return from nothing but bare dirt.

I don't think St Aug is more maintenance than bermuda. If you just let the bermuda go and aren't trying to have a putting green, well, maybe it is easier. Most of the bermuda-heads here are looking for picture perfect lawns. St Aug can be mowed weekly at 4 inches or every other week at 4 inches. Bermuda looks best when mowed at 1 inch every 3 days. And contrary to what you read almost everywhere, if you want bermuda to look good, it takes exactly as much water as St Augustine, zoysia, or any other grass. And if you want the bermuda to look good, it needs to be fertilized every month with a fertilizer high in N. St Aug can get by on three doses of fertilizer per year.

With this rain that just went though, NOW is the time for fall pre-em. That should take out all the spring wild flower plants you would otherwise see. Although with your daily watering schedule, those might be inevitable. I live on the edge of the desert in George West and have not watered anything since the rain a week ago. In Magnolia this time of year you should be going no more than once a week and hopefully once every 10 days. The starting point is usually to water a full inch when you water. In your situation I would start with 3 hours and see how much water you capture in several tuna or cat food cans. I'm betting you'll be up with me in taking 8 full hours to get an inch of water. In the shade in San Antonio I normally water 3 hours, once per week.

St Aug will usually crowd out grassy weeds but not broad leaf weeds. If you get horse herb in there, you'll have to spray. It will blanket all the grass and take it all out. Watch for it in the spring.

[Sixohh]

i really appreciate you input. i think the bermuda actually took off from all the water i was putting down on the SA.

once i saw it was taking off i started hitting the entire lawn with a lot of water. one thing id like to clear up, when i say i was watering every day it was before this rain... 100* every day out side. i watered every day but different zones. it would be safe to say each zone got water about every 3rd day. with the texas summer heat trust me, it was time to hit it!. the SA on the other hand got water almost every night in small doses. its kind of on a small hill so the water drains right off. plus it doesn't have a good root system established yet. i left town for a 4 days weekend last month ago, watering heavy before i left and i almost lost it all. it was cooked.

with the rain we just got, i havent watered in 5 days, period. and i still have moisture in the soil. a lot has changed tho. we went from 100* days to several inches of rain followed by vERY cool days. here it is almost noon at 73*. unheard of for us this time of year so early.

i used to do a LOT of work in george west on the rigs before we slowed down!

So, recommendations on a fall pre-em? buy locally ? online? brands? type?
i need to read up on the pre em's i reckon!

thanks again everyone! in a few years i hope to have some uniformity!