Richlawn 5-3-2? Others?

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Hammbone81
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Richlawn 5-3-2? Others?

Post by Hammbone81 » October 13th, 2020, 1:00 pm

Is anyone using Richlawn 5-3-2?

I have a local source that has it at a reasonable price. I'd say on par with Milo. Milo's high Fe isn't effective at greening my high pH (8.4) soil at my new house. It was awesome at my old house with pH=6.5.

I'm already thinking about sources of organics for 2021. I may resort to alfalfa and SBM too. Unfortunately not a lot of microbial activity in my lawn, so the digestion rate will be slow. But I have been dumping as much organics on my lawn for the past 3 summers as I can, so I'm working on it.

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MorpheusPA
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Re: Richlawn 5-3-2? Others?

Post by MorpheusPA » October 14th, 2020, 2:32 pm

I don't use it, but if you're asking if it's OK, it's fine. The source is dried poultry manure, which is tolerable as a source of organics.
I would recommend against use on a vegetable garden just as I would recommend against using any manure on a vegetable garden regardless of processing.

As with any organic, if you can mix it up with other organics occasionally, that would be great. If not, no big problem, but a little variation is always a wonderful thing if you can manage it.

Now...a warning. It's comparatively high phosphorus for the nitrogen kick, so use over time will lead to a phosphorus overload in your soil. At a very high pH like you have, that's not going to be a huge issue as P availability is quite low and I'd personally set your P target at around 400 or even higher. I haven't seen your soil test so...

But keep that in mind. At some point, you'll want to discontinue use, and use near to ground freeze isn't a good idea as it could erode off into water sources. Phosphorus in water supplies is Not A Good Idea and we'll all thank everybody for being careful not to do that.

Hammbone81
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Re: Richlawn 5-3-2? Others?

Post by Hammbone81 » October 14th, 2020, 11:49 pm

Thanks Morph. Here's the link. Soil is ugly.

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25477&hilit=Hammbone81+soil

I didn't test it this year. I got sternly spoken to by a local SiteOne agronomist for only testing the 1" at the 3-4" depth. He highly recommended sending in 6" cores, and the entire core.

Hammbone81
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Re: Richlawn 5-3-2? Others?

Post by Hammbone81 » October 15th, 2020, 7:18 am

Thanks Morph. Here's the link. Soil is ugly.

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=25477&hilit=Hammbone81+soil

I didn't test it this year. I got sternly spoken to by a local SiteOne agronomist for only testing the 1" at the 3-4" depth. He highly recommended sending in 6" cores, and the entire core.

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MorpheusPA
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Re: Richlawn 5-3-2? Others?

Post by MorpheusPA » October 15th, 2020, 12:46 pm

Gotcha. With an 82 P level, you can probably use this stuff for the foreseeable future before we're talking about saturating your phosphorus levels. That's actually good because we'll be supplying a nice, steady trickle to the lawn as the manure decays as well, whereas your soil would not. That's seriously going to help in terms of resources in several ways and give the lawn a momentary shot at absorbing something.

I'm liking the idea of a nice organic, too, so use it as heavily as you want. 20 pounds per thousand square feet in mid-May, August first, September first, and October first would be fine by me. That's the end of your decay season, giving the last one time to rot in before winter hits (with some remaining in the soil at the tail end to kick off spring).

And again, I'm OK with Milorganite, soybean meal (you're in soy country too), or most other organics being used at an equivalent of 1 pound of nitrogen per thousand square feet. Or 18 pounds of Milo per thousand, 15 pounds of soy per thousand, or 60 pounds of cracked corn per thousand (not a misprint; corn is light on protein). Skip the corn, in other words, except as a soil conditioner and extra "treat" for the grass at about 20 per K.

Your winterization will need to be synthetic, but that's true of all of us. Urea, ammonium sulfate, whatever you want. At your pH, it doesn't matter. Both will result in acidic reactions, which will help a little bit over time. Not much, but hey, take what we can get, right? Urea should be cheap in Iowa, or any off the shelf fertilizer. Target about a pound of nitrogen.


Hammbone81
Posts: 76
Joined: June 4th, 2018, 10:18 am
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Re: Richlawn 5-3-2? Others?

Post by Hammbone81 » October 21st, 2020, 1:29 pm

Thanks for the response Morph.
So regarding living in Iowa - I live 5 blocks from a feed mill (and the owner's daughter is friends with mine). I can pretty much get anything I need there. Further down the street is an Ag Supply company that has LARGE quantities of dry fertilizers (urea, potash, elemental sulfur, etc.) They also have a micronutrient product that I need to look into.

Nonetheless, just thinking about 2021 organic plan - I'm thinking for spring / early summer I'm going to use SBM, alfalfa, Richlawn 5-3-2 and HumicDG. I'm game for other insight as well.

Fall 2021 I'm going to put down an organic in mid-August (probably Richlawn or Earthworks Replenish 5-4-5), then go with the aggressive approach with frequent light doses of urea since I have an irrigation system now! ...and of course urea in November.

Another thought - would there be any advantage of using Ammonium Sulfate in place of urea in an attempt to drive my pH down from 8+? Will the sulfur in that help at all? (Sorry, my chemistry knowledge stops at doing stoichiometric equations for combustion reactions - and that was 15+ years ago.)

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MorpheusPA
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Re: Richlawn 5-3-2? Others?

Post by MorpheusPA » October 21st, 2020, 4:06 pm

Heh, I dated an engineer who did substoichiometric pyrolysis. I learned a lot.

If you know a lady who knows a lady, that's great. Expect to pay full price or show up on Reddit, (inside joke), but at least you have it easily available. Feed mills will be great sources of soybean meal (7-1-2) and cracked corn, (1.65-0.65-0.45) which will be handy. The referenced name product is also wonderful, but stuff with names always costs more and doesn't do a better job. I source soy at $15 per fifty pounds to feed the lawn. Soy application rates are 15 pounds per thousand square feet in May, August, September, and October here in PA. I'll use a synthetic in November as it's too cold for anything else.

Corn's great as a soil conditioner and can go any time, but I usually apply it in late April to May to take advantage of some other characteristics people argue about (some minor fungal protection). A second drop in September wouldn't go amiss. Any rate from 10 to 60 pounds per thousand is fine, but only the 50-60 rate counts as a feeding, really.

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MorpheusPA
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Re: Richlawn 5-3-2? Others?

Post by MorpheusPA » October 21st, 2020, 4:10 pm

I'd already hit submit. You can use ammonium sulfate if you want, no problem, if the price is right. At about 21-0-0 to urea's 46-0-0, it'd need to be about half the price and a little better. It usually won't be.

Urea will also acidify, so no harm no foul there, it's just that urea isn't quite so good at it. With a pH like that, it really doesn't matter. It's really high.

Sulfur doesn't work well at that pH. The amounts required are ridiculous, need to be dug in (surface-applied sulfur is mostly lost to the air as smog), and take forever. In that soil, they wouldn't activate well as the sulfur-loving bacteria only work at an acidic pH. Which you don't have and can't easily generate even in small spots.

I'm almost inclined to say that sulfur doesn't work "at all" at that pH, but it isn't strictly true. I could make it work...but it wouldn't be pretty.

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