Anybody Vape?

[MorpheusPA]

Oh, no worries on the nic level recommendation. It was certainly a good starting point. He also likes having it around for when he gets a more intense craving. A big reason he went with a lower level on these new flavors is that the habit he's forming with it isn't based around "sessions" like with a cigarette (if he was using it "a cigarette at a time," the 18 would probably be correct). He sets the vape down, walks by it a little while later and has a few puffs, sets it back down again.... He seems to want to be vaping more than he "needs" to from a nicotine-level standpoint, which ends in a nicotine buzz and slightly frustrated frontal-headache (because he wants to keep vaping). So, the answer seems to be to back off the nicotine level so that he can stand to enjoy a few more puffs. He's also getting the hang of taking shallower breaths.

His habits are already changing? He's fast, at this point I was still in figuring out how to use this stuff mode.

I used to chain smoke, so I still chain vape. I'm actually finding I put it down more and more and don't miss it for periods of up to fifteen minutes (which is a minor miracle for me). When it's hitting half an hour I'll cut my nicotine level back.

It's weird, I just sort of forget I vape. I'd have sooner forgotten my glasses than my cigarettes before.

As for the hookah thing, I kinda had to chuckle to myself in a dark-humor sort of way over our shopping trip last night. We went from the vape shop for Nick, down the street to the hookah shop for me, and I had the sudden realization that I'm going to be the one with the blacker lungs!

Sort of. Occasional tobacco use isn't something my doctor was all that concerned about (or, smoke 3 cigs a day? It won't hurt you enough to measure over a lifetime on average and your system can clean it faster than it builds up).

Occasional hookah use isn't something I'd concern myself about unless you already have an issue where it should, like COPD, emphysema, or other lung disease.

To be fair, we set up the hookah MAYBE once a week (probably more like once every 2 weeks or so), and I've never smoked it alone. The only reason we were going after more tobacco is because we were sick of the only flavor I had at my house, and the flavors we had chosen at the sketchy shop turned out to be truly heinous. It was a brand I'd used before, but I must have picked out the utterly wrong flavors this time. It tasted like sickly sweet fruit syrup and was giving both of us a sugar-rush-type head- and stomachache.

That sounds delightful, truly. I've gotten a few liquids like that, where they were just too sweet-tasting for me and made me a little nauseated because of it. I don't tend to favor sweets in the first place and prefer them balanced by a bitter, sour, or salty flavor.

Wanting to give it a chance, we sat there eating saltines and drinking pale ale in an attempt to balance the flavor. Yeahhhh.... probably not worth it!

While some things go very well together--like sharp cheese and chocolate--it's usually not worth it to try to adjust to something you can't stand, no.

The only exception was a sweet candy designed to be eaten with an exceedingly bitter tea. Neither was palatable alone, but together they actually worked well. It's still not something I'd choose for casual use, but as a more exotic tea-drinking experience, it was great. For casual use, give me Lipton or Plantation Mint.

Thought did occur to me that I could vape instead of smoking hookah (though it would lack that pleasant "hookah head" experience), but with my rather addictive personality, I would probably manage to get hooked on even 0 nic vaping due to enjoying the movement.

It's possible, although you'd only have the psychological addiction since you can't get addicted to any of the ingredients. For the hookah head, which I presume is a nicotine buzz, moving to 6 mg/ml would give you that--but only if you could restrict your vaping to the same conditions you use the hookah.

In your case, it does sound like a not so hot idea. 0 nic would be a better idea.

I'm probably better off with my current couple-times-a-month vice, as long as I stick to my rule of never setting it up without having company over. If I find myself beginning to break that rule, or discover that I keep sneaking puffs of Nick's vape, yeah, you betcha I'll just give in and buy one instead of going down that other road. For now, though, it's just way too easy to pick up and enjoy those little gadgets!! (Buuuut that's not to say I won't change my mind later, especially if Nick gets into mixing his own flavors and just has some 0 nic liquid sitting around....)

Some of that is the novelty, which will fade. At this point for me, this is a habit like any other, just one that's unlikely to kill me (and doesn't cause shortness of breath, sinus infections, kill my senses of taste and smell, and so on). Although I could get hit by a bus while trying to dig my Volt out of my pocket, that would be incidental.

With resounding doctors' approval, it's also one I'm not in any great hurry to give up. I refuse to deal with the jones.

Probably the most pleasant side effect so far has been his smell. I gave him a peck on the cheek this morning and his beard smelled inexplicably like cotton candy.

Ethyl maltol, a common sweetener. It's used in candy-making, and smells and tastes like cotton candy. It's a common sweetener in vape liquids because it's harmless, cheap, and sweetens very well in very small amounts. Flavoring companies sell it for adding to home-made liquids.

It also hangs in the air and on clothes. I can whiff a touch of it in my office if I walk out for a while--it's a component in my cinnamon flavoring and even more in my milk chocolate.

I don't object to it. I'd rather smell that than cigarette smoke.

The most unpleasant side effect has been when he cleared his throat while we were watching a movie last night and ended up having to sprint to the deck to hock up a loogie.

Thanks for the image. Yep, that's the worst thing most of us go through--smoker's flu. All those little cilia in his lungs are re-growing and starting to be able to clear the tar out. As the tar clears, they get more efficient and can move better without the muck, and the process accelerates.

It does come to an end, and seems to start and stop at almost random points in time for everybody. It took about a week for anything to start moving for me, and at this point it's gone.

With the side effect that I barely breathe any longer. It doesn't take that much oxygen to supply 145 pounds of human, and my lung capacity tests larger than average anyway (why, nobody knows, it's just genetic).

Forgot to mention - That's interesting on the diet thing. I'd be interested to see some studies done on the long-term health effects. Not for me personally, as ADHD meds cause my diet to tend more toward the calorie-deficient side anyway, just for pure curiosity's sake. I could see how it might help folks who have the right mindset to let it.

We're all waiting for the long-term studies. Plenty of people use PG quite a lot, and it's been around for ages. Hospitals add it to their air systems. We're pretty sure it's harmless even in comparatively huge quantities, and it's minimally toxic (problems are usually from IV application or children drinking large amounts of it). We use it in nebulizers for people with lung problems, and inhalers for asthmatics.

We actually use PG as a substitute for ethylene glycol in anti-freeze to make it safer. PG-based anti-freeze isn't something you need to worry about if a dog licks up a small amount--regular anti-freeze will kill.

About 2% of people are sensitive or allergic to PG. Vegetable glycerine (VG) is the preferred alternative in that case. Issues tend to be minor but extremely annoying.

Breathing flavoring isn't the best thing for you, we know that, but there's no indication that any approved flavoring (some aren't approved, like butter flavors as we know those are damaging) cause issues.

Vapers have been around for about 9 years, during which time you'd expect the outliers at the end of the curve to have problems if there were any. That hasn't happened. The only vapers that have died were cigarette smokers, already developed their issues, and would have died anyway.

[NiciPicki]

His habits are already changing? He's fast, at this point I was still in figuring out how to use this stuff mode.

It seems to almost be a response of, "Oo, I like that thing! Let's have a puff!" whenever he sees it, which is resulting in not needing enough for a full "cigarette" at a time. Probably has something to do with the novelty you mention later on. I'd roughly liken it to having a bag of your favorite chips in front of you, and being unable to stop eating them even though you're not hungry anymore. Or just eating a little bit all day rather than having specified meals. Graze-vaping (Vape-grazing?).

Sort of. Occasional tobacco use isn't something my doctor was all that concerned about (or, smoke 3 cigs a day? It won't hurt you enough to measure over a lifetime on average and your system can clean it faster than it builds up).

Occasional hookah use isn't something I'd concern myself about unless you already have an issue where it should, like COPD, emphysema, or other lung disease.

Heh, yeah, I may have thrown a bit of hyperbole in there. My respiratory system is almost certainly still pretty pure.

The only exception was a sweet candy designed to be eaten with an exceedingly bitter tea. Neither was palatable alone, but together they actually worked well. It's still not something I'd choose for casual use, but as a more exotic tea-drinking experience, it was great.

That does sound fun to try. I always liked the super dark chocolate with a sweet port wine. Makes the bitter chocolate taste like milk chocolate, and the port taste like.... well.... not so sickly-sweet.

Some of that is the novelty, which will fade.

Yep, this is very very true, and probably the #1 reason why I didn't give in to the urge to buy one to match. Kept reminding myself that just because I'm a gadget junkie and enjoy the occasional smoking session, it does not warrant turning that into a full-fledged habit. Or even a temporary habit. Totally unnecessary.

Ethyl maltol, a common sweetener. It's used in candy-making, and smells and tastes like cotton candy. It's a common sweetener in vape liquids because it's harmless, cheap, and sweetens very well in very small amounts. Flavoring companies sell it for adding to home-made liquids.

It also hangs in the air and on clothes. I can whiff a touch of it in my office if I walk out for a while--it's a component in my cinnamon flavoring and even more in my milk chocolate.

Aha! That explains it. The RY4 he bought last night is a little bit sweet (according to him), but we were pretty perplexed as to why it had such a relatively huge cotton candy smell when his other flavors have zero smell (aside from the occasional hint of mint from the mint chocolate). He'll be glad to hear this explanation as well, because I think the smell was beginning to confuse his senses into thinking the RY4 was somehow sweeter than it actually is, if that makes any sense....
Tastebuds: Oh hey, this is a little sweet.
Nose: NOPE IT'S COTTON CANDY, THE SWEETEST OF THEM ALL!
Tastebuds: Um.... no.... well, wait, maybe you're right.... Er....

I don't object to it. I'd rather smell that than cigarette smoke.

I don't object either. Cotton candy beard >> Cigarette beard

Thanks for the image. Yep, that's the worst thing most of us go through--smoker's flu. All those little cilia in his lungs are re-growing and starting to be able to clear the tar out. As the tar clears, they get more efficient and can move better without the muck, and the process accelerates.

It does come to an end, and seems to start and stop at almost random points in time for everybody. It took about a week for anything to start moving for me, and at this point it's gone.

With the side effect that I barely breathe any longer. It doesn't take that much oxygen to supply 145 pounds of human, and my lung capacity tests larger than average anyway (why, nobody knows, it's just genetic).

I'd imagine he doesn't have a ton of build-up, but then again I'm no doctor. He's 26 years old and has been smoking for maybe 10 years, off and on (mostly on). That 15 cigarettes/day was on a really bad day, and I'm not sure he ever really exceeded that for many days in a row at any point. Could be wrong, as he's not sitting here beside me to give a more accurate guess. At any rate, I already promised I'd baby him through the "flu" in support of his decision to quit. Here's hoping he doesn't abuse that promise.

We're all waiting for the long-term studies. Plenty of people use PG quite a lot, and it's been around for ages. Hospitals add it to their air systems. We're pretty sure it's harmless even in comparatively huge quantities, and it's minimally toxic (problems are usually from IV application or children drinking large amounts of it). We use it in nebulizers for people with lung problems, and inhalers for asthmatics.

We actually use PG as a substitute for ethylene glycol in anti-freeze to make it safer. PG-based anti-freeze isn't something you need to worry about if a dog licks up a small amount--regular anti-freeze will kill.

About 2% of people are sensitive or allergic to PG. Vegetable glycerine (VG) is the preferred alternative in that case. Issues tend to be minor but extremely annoying.

Breathing flavoring isn't the best thing for you, we know that, but there's no indication that any approved flavoring (some aren't approved, like butter flavors as we know those are damaging) cause issues.

Vapers have been around for about 9 years, during which time you'd expect the outliers at the end of the curve to have problems if there were any. That hasn't happened. The only vapers that have died were cigarette smokers, already developed their issues, and would have died anyway.

I didn't realize vaping had been been around even that long. I agree, you'd think that if it caused anything horrific on its own, we'd have seen at least a hint of it by now.

Butter flavors.... I cannot imagine a situation in which that would taste good to inhale. I just keep imagining spraying some of that butter-flavored cooking spray into my mouth and taking a deep breath, and that does not sound tasty.

[Dave76]

He did mention last night that his Spinner already has a few fine scratches on it. I've come up with a few other ideas for everyday travel packs and I hope to get working on a prototype soon. We visited the downtown vape store last night, and it seemed like the type of place that may be interested in selling them if I do this right.

I'd buy one. They have at least one ready made customer if they list it on their web site.

As for the diet thing, it kind of works for me. I have some strawberry cream pie and banana split juices that I'll load up and vape when I have a craving for sweets. It's not like the weight is falling off of me or anything but I've avoided a few cookies and doughnuts that would otherwise have been eaten.

[MorpheusPA]

It seems to almost be a response of, "Oo, I like that thing! Let's have a puff!" whenever he sees it, which is resulting in not needing enough for a full "cigarette" at a time. Probably has something to do with the novelty you mention later on. I'd roughly liken it to having a bag of your favorite chips in front of you, and being unable to stop eating them even though you're not hungry anymore. Or just eating a little bit all day rather than having specified meals. Graze-vaping (Vape-grazing?).

Most people seem to head for vazing (vape-grazing) eventually. Because of the slower nicotine absorption, it works well. Pick up, puff once or twice, put down. Repeat.

Plus, given the limited absorption, you're slowly breaking your addiction to the nicotine to a certain extent anyway. My fits are definitely a lot lighter than they were two months ago.

Heh, yeah, I may have thrown a bit of hyperbole in there. My respiratory system is almost certainly still pretty pure.

Given that you live in a populated, industrial area, I doubt that. But they're not much worse than anybody else's.

Aha! That explains it. The RY4 he bought last night is a little bit sweet (according to him), but we were pretty perplexed as to why it had such a relatively huge cotton candy smell when his other flavors have zero smell (aside from the occasional hint of mint from the mint chocolate).

It does vary. Some RY4 can be very sweet, others not so much. Very few of my flavorings have large amounts of ethyl maltol in them, except for bubble gum (which I do enjoy), and that has huge amounts in it. That stuff will make your hair, clothes, and surroundings smell of cotton candy pretty strongly.

Since it's definitely a sweet flavor (I have to cut it with peppermint or spearmint to richen it a little), there's no nose/tongue competition.

He'll be glad to hear this explanation as well, because I think the smell was beginning to confuse his senses into thinking the RY4 was somehow sweeter than it actually is, if that makes any sense....
Tastebuds: Oh hey, this is a little sweet.
Nose: NOPE IT'S COTTON CANDY, THE SWEETEST OF THEM ALL!
Tastebuds: Um.... no.... well, wait, maybe you're right.... Er....

The nose is surprisingly closely involved with the tastebuds. For that reason, he may decide not to return to that particular flavor.

Steeping a week or two will, again, help out the ethyl maltol to integrate a little more, just like chili and pot roast always taste better the second day.

I'd imagine he doesn't have a ton of build-up, but then again I'm no doctor. He's 26 years old and has been smoking for maybe 10 years, off and on (mostly on). That 15 cigarettes/day was on a really bad day, and I'm not sure he ever really exceeded that for many days in a row at any point. Could be wrong, as he's not sitting here beside me to give a more accurate guess. At any rate, I already promised I'd baby him through the "flu" in support of his decision to quit. Here's hoping he doesn't abuse that promise.

It seems to be person-dependent too. My father smoked 3 to 4 packs a day of heavy-hitters, and his lungs were pretty clear. Mine showed some static when I had my echocardiogram done, but the nurse said it wasn't awful or anything, just something they had to read through.

I didn't realize vaping had been been around even that long. I agree, you'd think that if it caused anything horrific on its own, we'd have seen at least a hint of it by now.

Technically, it was invented on this go around in 2003, although there was an electric cigarette in design in the 1960's. It never caught on because of the difficulty of use, poor batteries available at the time, and ease of finding cigarettes comparatively. Plus we didn't know what we know today--my mom smoked while pregnant, it was really common in the sixties.

Today's smaller, cheaper, lighter, more efficient electronics, higher-capacity long-life rechargeable lithium batteries, and cigarette health concerns have helped raise the industry to one that should compete with cigarettes in the next ten to fifteen years barring government interference.

I had my first (not so good) experience with an e-cig about five years ago, maybe six at this point. At the time, the technology just wasn't there yet.

Today, it's close. It's still more complicated than I think it should be, but it's finally workable. But even back then I could see the promise if only the companies would actually think about how people use things.

Butter flavors.... I cannot imagine a situation in which that would taste good to inhale. I just keep imagining spraying some of that butter-flavored cooking spray into my mouth and taking a deep breath, and that does not sound tasty.

Fortunately, they're rare, although many bakery flavors would rely on a buttery tone to complete the flavor. So would popcorn, actually. I'm not sure what the bakery flavors use, but they don't use butter flavor if they're good manufacturers. That stuff will give you lung disease--to the point that you really shouldn't inhale over your butter flavored popcorn unless you actually used butter on it.

For this reason, I use butter, just smaller amounts of it, over margarine or anything else.

As for the diet thing, it kind of works for me. I have some strawberry cream pie and banana split juices that I'll load up and vape when I have a craving for sweets. It's not like the weight is falling off of me or anything but I've avoided a few cookies and doughnuts that would otherwise have been eaten.

Right now, I'm on the up-swing on weight (it's the holiday season, and the outside work is done for the year...there's an inch of snow down!)

But prior to this I'd suddenly dropped 10 pounds. The only thing it could have been was the vape causing me to avoid sweets.

[NiciPicki]

First of all, I'd just like to start out by saying....
Zero cigarettes yesterday!
(I'm a rather proud girlfriend.)

I'd buy one. They have at least one ready made customer if they list it on their web site.

Good to know. I haven't had time to make it to a fabric store yet, but I hope to sometime this week. At the very least, I've been planning on making an Etsy store for a while anyway - I've gotten several requests for some of the things I've made, non-vape-related.

Most people seem to head for vazing (vape-grazing) eventually. Because of the slower nicotine absorption, it works well. Pick up, puff once or twice, put down. Repeat.

Plus, given the limited absorption, you're slowly breaking your addiction to the nicotine to a certain extent anyway. My fits are definitely a lot lighter than they were two months ago.

Heh, vazing, there we go!

Given that you live in a populated, industrial area, I doubt that. But they're not much worse than anybody else's.

Touche. My house also backs up next to a highway, so I'm sure the air nearby isn't the cleanest. Thankfully, it's a less-busy stretch of highway (comparatively) since I live outside the loop.

It does vary. Some RY4 can be very sweet, others not so much. Very few of my flavorings have large amounts of ethyl maltol in them, except for bubble gum (which I do enjoy), and that has huge amounts in it. That stuff will make your hair, clothes, and surroundings smell of cotton candy pretty strongly.

The RY4 is currently his all-day vape, at least at this early stage. He switches it out for the Flue-Cured when he wants something that tastes more like a cigarette or a higher nicotine level, but the RY4 gives a more consistent throat hit. This morning he was switching them back and forth every several minutes or so, with an increasingly-longer time spent with the RY4 each time.

I noticed last night that, after sitting next to him while he vaped the RY4, my hair smelled like cotton candy. I don't mind. There are certainly worse things to smell like.

The nose is surprisingly closely involved with the tastebuds. For that reason, he may decide not to return to that particular flavor.

Steeping a week or two will, again, help out the ethyl maltol to integrate a little more, just like chili and pot roast always taste better the second day.

He confirmed last night that his initial impression of it being too sweet was likely just smell/taste confusion. It doesn't taste terribly sweet, but the smell is so strong that it's hard to ignore. He loves the stuff now.

Today, it's close. It's still more complicated than I think it should be, but it's finally workable. But even back then I could see the promise if only the companies would actually think about how people use things.

If it's more complicated than it should be, do you have ideas for how to make it better? As in, have you considered making your own little device? (I know you're a tinkerer, just curious if you've given this any thought!)

Fortunately, they're rare, although many bakery flavors would rely on a buttery tone to complete the flavor. So would popcorn, actually. I'm not sure what the bakery flavors use, but they don't use butter flavor if they're good manufacturers. That stuff will give you lung disease--to the point that you really shouldn't inhale over your butter flavored popcorn unless you actually used butter on it.

Yikes. How do you know what types of ingredients each company uses? I was having a hard enough time just figuring out what country each company was from, let alone any other specifics. AltSmoke appears to only use American suppliers, but other than that, I don't know much about their liquids.

Right now, I'm on the up-swing on weight (it's the holiday season, and the outside work is done for the year...there's an inch of snow down!)

An inch of snow!! The temperature is increasing to 60 here this weekend! (I actually need to mow quite badly....)

[MorpheusPA]

First of all, I'd just like to start out by saying....
Zero cigarettes yesterday!
(I'm a rather proud girlfriend.)

Send our congratulations!

Depending on his response to the chemicals in cigarettes, the itch to have one may grow over a few days. Some people never get that and are fine on the vape.

Mom's had absolutely no desire to smoke, and both she and I still have a few packs lying around going stale.

Good to know. I haven't had time to make it to a fabric store yet, but I hope to sometime this week. At the very least, I've been planning on making an Etsy store for a while anyway - I've gotten several requests for some of the things I've made, non-vape-related.

I'd like to see that store! And then, for some fun, when you're finished setting it up go to http://www.regretsy.com (where DIY meets WTF) and make sure you don't get featured!

Touche. My house also backs up next to a highway, so I'm sure the air nearby isn't the cleanest. Thankfully, it's a less-busy stretch of highway (comparatively) since I live outside the loop.

Draw a circle around the heavily industrial area of the country. Put a dot in the middle. You just put the dot on my house.

The RY4 is currently his all-day vape, at least at this early stage. He switches it out for the Flue-Cured when he wants something that tastes more like a cigarette or a higher nicotine level, but the RY4 gives a more consistent throat hit. This morning he was switching them back and forth every several minutes or so, with an increasingly-longer time spent with the RY4 each time.

Tastes do change, so don't be too surprised by that. I was attached to Kool liquid at first, now I can't stand the stuff. Too harsh.

I noticed last night that, after sitting next to him while he vaped the RY4, my hair smelled like cotton candy. I don't mind. There are certainly worse things to smell like.

Unfortunately, you'll become a beacon for clowns and children.

[quote[He confirmed last night that his initial impression of it being too sweet was likely just smell/taste confusion. It doesn't taste terribly sweet, but the smell is so strong that it's hard to ignore. He loves the stuff now.[/quote]

As his sense of taste and smell gets stronger, that confusion tends to fade. Things smell like they taste. As to whether the tongue or nose strengthens more, at least in my case my nose became much more responsive.

But I never had much of a sense of smell anyway. Now it's just up to well below average. What other people say they smell I can't detect.

If it's more complicated than it should be, do you have ideas for how to make it better? As in, have you considered making your own little device? (I know you're a tinkerer, just curious if you've given this any thought!)

I could throw together a box mod for myself with no issues that would do everything I want (really, it's very simple). But the issue with that is that it'd do everything *I* want, not necessarily a good general guide for people.

There'd be a dial with exactly three click positions on it--low (5 watts), medium (6 watts) and high (7 watts), with the electronics adjusting the wattage to the resistance of the cartomizer/tank placed on it. The draw would be automatic. The inset LED would only light when the battery voltage fell to near-recharging; using a bi-color LED would give me a warning light and a power out light.

That covers the breadth of settings I want--exactly one simple setting.

Really, the Spinner does well enough, and the Volt is fine most of the time.

As far as the liquid system, I'd like an automatic feeder with a 10 ml+ capacity (in-box) so I only have to fill every 2 to 3 days or so.

Yikes. How do you know what types of ingredients each company uses? I was having a hard enough time just figuring out what country each company was from, let alone any other specifics. AltSmoke appears to only use American suppliers, but other than that, I don't know much about their liquids.

In most cases, you don't know what they use--but if you trust the company that's not a major issue. Some will specifically state "we don't use..." Most will be happy to tell you if they use a specific chemical.

Making my own, I know exactly what's going into it (even the flavorings have the listed ingredients on the sites, and I tend to use TFA--The Flavorer's Apprentice--as they're very complete with their ingredients list, and very careful to indicate which ones shouldn't be used for vaping).

An inch of snow!! The temperature is increasing to 60 here this weekend! (I actually need to mow quite badly....)

That weather gets here over the weekend. That inch is now down to 1/4" and melting fast, with temperatures warming into the high thirties.

[NiciPicki]

I'll respond a little better later (busy day), but before I forget: Will magnets mess up a vape? I'm guessing no (except for maybe the ones with a small readout screen) but it seems like a good idea to check....

[MorpheusPA]

I'll respond a little better later (busy day), but before I forget: Will magnets mess up a vape? I'm guessing no (except for maybe the ones with a small readout screen) but it seems like a good idea to check....

They shouldn't, no. Would I put mine in the middle of an enormous electromagnet like an MRI? No. But that would be a bad idea with anything that has iron in it.

Would I worry about airport X-ray equipment or regular/electromagnets of normal or even pretty large size? No.

[Billybob]

Like Morph's father,my father smoked about 3 packs of chesterfield non filters a day for about 25 yrs. had a heart attack at age 50 scared him enough to quit.

22yrs. Later he died of lung cancer. No symptoms,one day he woke up and thought he developed asthma and 3 weeks later he died. Quit now! Bad stuff

[MorpheusPA]

Like Morph's father,my father smoked about 3 packs of chesterfield non filters a day for about 25 yrs. had a heart attack at age 50 scared him enough to quit.

22yrs. Later he died of lung cancer. No symptoms,one day he woke up and thought he developed asthma and 3 weeks later he died. Quit now! Bad stuff

First off, sorry about your dad! Mine died of...well, he died of something. Even the doctor said he didn't know what to write on the death certificate with the list of everything wrong with my father. Finally, "heart failure" was what made it on there in doctorese.

He managed to survive seven blockages, heart valve replacement, lung cancer, pneumonia (several times) and plenty of other stuff. How, we'll never know. Even one of his carotid arteries was 100% blocked (when they caught that the other one was 90% blocked, so it's durned good they did).

It seems, perhaps, a bit odd (although not if you sit down and think about it). Most people who develop lung cancer never smoked, never lived with a smoker, and never had significant exposure to cigarette smoke.

Frankly, they do over-blow (read: lie) about the statistics a little bit...OK, a lot. Yes, if you smoke you have a fifty percent chance of dying of a smoking-related illness. Absolutely true. If you include all fatal heart attacks and strokes in there as well, since there's definitely a correlation.

Of course, if you never smoked, never saw a cigarette in your life, and never smelled one, you have a 30% chance of dying of a smoking-related illness, except they won't call it that or shake their heads.

Some things they never mention. If you smoke, you have a vastly reduced risk of Parkinson's Disease, and onset will be later and slower than otherwise. You also have a lower chance of Alzheimer's Disease and development is similarly slowed (or, in some cases, reversed). Nobody, of course, is recommending that you smoke to counter these (any nicotine source provides the same protection). It helps control clinical depression and ADHD as well.

[Billybob]

Controls ADHD.....I'm going to buy my son a pack today. Just kidding. Interesting though. I've got to say I am a little surprised about the statistics. I don't doubt it.

[NiciPicki]

Send our congratulations!

I did, and he says thanks. We were just talking this morning about how he may not have ended up with one if we didn't have you and JC here with all the tips and suggestions. It's a confusing world to get into at first.

Depending on his response to the chemicals in cigarettes, the itch to have one may grow over a few days. Some people never get that and are fine on the vape.

Mom's had absolutely no desire to smoke, and both she and I still have a few packs lying around going stale.

He went yesterday with no cigarettes as well. He said the urge to have one is growing, but so far he's been able to fight it back with the vape. There is a pack of Camel Lights in my freezer currently; the guy at the vape store encouraged Nick to just throw 'em out. I don't think he has yet and I don't blame him for that. It's been less than a week - feeling the need for a safety net is perfectly acceptable!

I'd like to see that store! And then, for some fun, when you're finished setting it up go to http://www.regretsy.com (where DIY meets WTF) and make sure you don't get featured!

Oh, dear sweet goodness. That site is outstanding. My non-vape stuff I have in mind for the store could be considered slightly WTF, but more in the "just not understanding the reference" way rather than the "holy crap that's terrifying" way. I'll be sure to threaten Nick with the spell (a couple items in), so he never gets any bad ideas! (Eh, on second thought, I REALLY don't want to touch that thing....)

Unfortunately, you'll become a beacon for clowns and children.

Both of which I find mysterious and a little terrifying.

I could throw together a box mod for myself with no issues that would do everything I want (really, it's very simple). But the issue with that is that it'd do everything *I* want, not necessarily a good general guide for people.

There'd be a dial with exactly three click positions on it--low (5 watts), medium (6 watts) and high (7 watts), with the electronics adjusting the wattage to the resistance of the cartomizer/tank placed on it. The draw would be automatic. The inset LED would only light when the battery voltage fell to near-recharging; using a bi-color LED would give me a warning light and a power out light.

That covers the breadth of settings I want--exactly one simple setting.

Really, the Spinner does well enough, and the Volt is fine most of the time.

As far as the liquid system, I'd like an automatic feeder with a 10 ml+ capacity (in-box) so I only have to fill every 2 to 3 days or so.

Heh, I asked the question knowing full well that you'd probably given it some thought. They don't seem like terribly complicated devices, and that's even coming from someone who has a very hard time understanding electrical systems.

On the subject of folks who make vapes, I found out that the Silver Bullet was made by a guy in my hometown. I went on AltSmoke to read about it assuming it was a lesser-known device, and noticed there were over 400 reviews of the thing! I guess both AltSmoke and the Silver Bullet are a little more popular than I thought.

In most cases, you don't know what they use--but if you trust the company that's not a major issue. Some will specifically state "we don't use..." Most will be happy to tell you if they use a specific chemical.

Gotcha. The butter flavor thing made both of us a little nervous, because Nick just got a Cinnabun flavor that he really likes. AltSmoke seems like it's run by knowledgeable and honest folks, so I don't think they'd knowingly sell something harmful. (When Nick went back to get a few more tanks yesterday, he asked the guy if he thought he should get more liquid. Instead of trying to sell more, Demetry was like, "Nah, man, you got enough for a while." Nice guy.)

Controls ADHD.....I'm going to buy my son a pack today. Just kidding.

Was just thinking the same thing for myself.

[NiciPicki]

They shouldn't, no. Would I put mine in the middle of an enormous electromagnet like an MRI? No. But that would be a bad idea with anything that has iron in it.

Would I worry about airport X-ray equipment or regular/electromagnets of normal or even pretty large size? No.

I really didn't think so, but also didn't want to do something super boneheaded out of ignorance. I was thinking about magnetic closures for the carrying cases, which would require a couple of tiny (but strong) magnets right near the vape. Really my main concern was for the devices with readout screens, because I know magnets can affect certain types of screens.

We've had a few other ideas, which I've been writing down and gathering a few materials for. Can't wait to get started on the actual creation process.

[MorpheusPA]

I did, and he says thanks. We were just talking this morning about how he may not have ended up with one if we didn't have you and JC here with all the tips and suggestions. It's a confusing world to get into at first.

It's confusing. My cousins wouldn't've bothered without me saying, "Just start with this" (they're getting Volt X2 automatics and basic cartomizers for ease of use). Post that, I've advised them they'll probably branch out a bit, but that will be in the future when they're comfortable with the idea.

He went yesterday with no cigarettes as well. He said the urge to have one is growing, but so far he's been able to fight it back with the vape.

I found that (for those who get the itch) putting it off as long as possible is best, but don't torture yourself.

It's a bit frustrating, but there's a plateau where you seem to need a (single) cigarette every X number of days to maintain sanity. Then suddenly that goes away, but it takes a while. Whatever alkaloid I was still addicted to took a while to fade out.

I kept reminding myself that in the time period where I would have had 200 cigarettes I had had 1 instead. That's not exactly a failure, it's a 99.5% success.

Recently it's been noted that I don't attach myself to my vape any longer and the constant grazing is fading.

There is a pack of Camel Lights in my freezer currently; the guy at the vape store encouraged Nick to just throw 'em out. I don't think he has yet and I don't blame him for that. It's been less than a week - feeling the need for a safety net is perfectly acceptable!

I still have two packs and a few spare cigs in the closet behind me. What's really weird is that they're seven feet away and I feel no real desire at all to go get one. My Zippo went dry weeks ago.

There's nothing wrong with a safety net, and some people intentionally leave them there for weeks or years. One enterprising person online made a shadowbox of her last pack of cigs, lighter, and (cleaned) ashtray for her wall to remind her of the fact that she a) no longer smoked, and b) was very proud of that fact.

Oh, dear sweet goodness. That site is outstanding. My non-vape stuff I have in mind for the store could be considered slightly WTF, but more in the "just not understanding the reference" way rather than the "holy crap that's terrifying" way. I'll be sure to threaten Nick with the spell (a couple items in), so he never gets any bad ideas! (Eh, on second thought, I REALLY don't want to touch that thing....)

I love Regretsy, they get all the strangest stuff on there. But "not understanding the reference" wouldn't do it, it has to be really, really off the wall to make that site. Surprisingly, there are two or three things a day that meet the bill!

I'm tempted to put the dog in one of those "Off Duty Porn Star" T-shirts for Christmas as a joke. The funny thing about that is that the dog is fixed...

Unfortunately, you'll become a beacon for clowns and children.

Both of which I find mysterious and a little terrifying.

You and me both.

Heh, I asked the question knowing full well that you'd probably given it some thought. They don't seem like terribly complicated devices, and that's even coming from someone who has a very hard time understanding electrical systems.

They're really simple. At their heart, a battery. Fixed voltage would use a voltage chip and power transistor to fire it when you hit the button. That's it. All else is just variable voltage delivery (which is still simple, requiring a tiny chip and a few high wattage resistors) or the more sophisticated airflow diaphragm for automatics.

I've used variable voltage chips (in fixed configurations) to drop voltage from the source to what I need. I made a simple USB charger that can take any power source from 7 volts to 24 volts, step it down to 5 volts, and charge anything that uses a USB plug. This came in handy during Sandy--hook up a 9 volt, charge an iPod or e-cig.

On the subject of folks who make vapes, I found out that the Silver Bullet was made by a guy in my hometown. I went on AltSmoke to read about it assuming it was a lesser-known device, and noticed there were over 400 reviews of the thing! I guess both AltSmoke and the Silver Bullet are a little more popular than I thought.

I considered a Silver Bullet there for a while--it ultimately got discarded because of size and price, but it's still in the running for the future. It's a great mod, particularly for around the house, and at 2,600 mAh it'd be a two day vape for me.

What I didn't like was the lack of variable voltage, but that's not a deal-killer. For the last few days I haven't moved from 3.6 volts.

Gotcha. The butter flavor thing made both of us a little nervous, because Nick just got a Cinnabun flavor that he really likes. AltSmoke seems like it's run by knowledgeable and honest folks, so I don't think they'd knowingly sell something harmful. (When Nick went back to get a few more tanks yesterday, he asked the guy if he thought he should get more liquid. Instead of trying to sell more, Demetry was like, "Nah, man, you got enough for a while." Nice guy.)

He's right, and he's also anticipating tar clearance from the tongue which will change Nick's sense of taste.

You're fortunate to have a local store that's good; Nick won't get caught short. The rest of us have to plan ahead.

Was just thinking the same thing for myself.

And this may explain your hookah usage as well--a lot of us smoke to self-medicate an undiagnosed or not completely controlled condition. In my case, moderate depression (I started smoking long before my diagnosis and eventual medications, which work beautifully).

The doctor already mentioned that I may find my meds aren't enough as/if my nicotine levels drop. I'm to call him immediately if I find myself anything other than normally quit-smoking very mildly depressed.

[NiciPicki]

Without me even telling him about the conversation on here regarding the pack in the freezer, out of the blue on the way home last night Nick said, "I was gonna throw away my last pack earlier, but I wanted to wait until you were there." So last night, he pulled it out of the freezer, gave it a nice crushing squeeze, and dropped it in the garbage! So long, Camel Lights!

The interesting thing to me about the depression stuff is that Nick's mood has actually leveled out considerably over the last few days. Many evenings (more often than not) when I'd get off work he'd be very anxious and irritable. I know it's still early, but I can see a change in him this week. He stated last night that the assessment about him actually being nicotine-intolerant may be correct. He's had trouble describing exactly what it is, but he does feel "different" and can see how that the cigarettes were really messing with his head. But since he's been smoking since he was about 14 or 15, it's hard to know what "normal" is. It takes about two puffs of the 18 mg Flue-Cured to send his head spinning and get him all extra-chatty and hyperactive. With the 12 mg RY4, he can vape steadily all day and not have any yo-yo effect (now that he's getting a better feel for his limits, of course - he's still overdone it a few times with the lower nic level). It's too early to get hopes up too high, as the excitement of quitting may certainly have something to do with his good mood, but it'd be pretty dang cool if this continues to help manage his anxiety stuff.

[MorpheusPA]

Without me even telling him about the conversation on here regarding the pack in the freezer, out of the blue on the way home last night Nick said, "I was gonna throw away my last pack earlier, but I wanted to wait until you were there." So last night, he pulled it out of the freezer, gave it a nice crushing squeeze, and dropped it in the garbage! So long, Camel Lights!

Congrats again! I feel better with my safety net, but obviously he doesn't require one!

The interesting thing to me about the depression stuff is that Nick's mood has actually leveled out considerably over the last few days. Many evenings (more often than not) when I'd get off work he'd be very anxious and irritable. I know it's still early, but I can see a change in him this week. He stated last night that the assessment about him actually being nicotine-intolerant may be correct.

Now that you mentioned it, I've also been extremely stable, comparatively speaking. The meds tend to dull out any emotional reactions so I'll always move toward the center anyway, but I've tended not to move FROM the center.

Nic intolerance certainly isn't my issue, not at 22 mg/ml and 5 ml per day. Maybe it's something to do with the much slower and more even delivery system as well.

He's had trouble describing exactly what it is, but he does feel "different" and can see how that the cigarettes were really messing with his head. But since he's been smoking since he was about 14 or 15, it's hard to know what "normal" is. It takes about two puffs of the 18 mg Flue-Cured to send his head spinning and get him all extra-chatty and hyperactive. With the 12 mg RY4, he can vape steadily all day and not have any yo-yo effect (now that he's getting a better feel for his limits, of course - he's still overdone it a few times with the lower nic level). It's too early to get hopes up too high, as the excitement of quitting may certainly have something to do with his good mood, but it'd be pretty dang cool if this continues to help manage his anxiety stuff.

We all over or under-do it at first (lately I find I under-do more often than I did before, and also find I don't need as much). Over-do, I haven't done in weeks.

[NiciPicki]

He's wondering (and I agree) if maybe the cigarettes were actually several spikes of overdoing it throughout the day. If he'd smoke one too fast, he'd go straight past nicotine-buzz into nicotine-sick. He has already started vaping the 12 mg a little less, which I think could also be attributed in part to the novelty fading a bit.

[MorpheusPA]

He's wondering (and I agree) if maybe the cigarettes were actually several spikes of overdoing it throughout the day. If he'd smoke one too fast, he'd go straight past nicotine-buzz into nicotine-sick. He has already started vaping the 12 mg a little less, which I think could also be attributed in part to the novelty fading a bit.

Camel Lights aren't exactly an ultra light, low nicotine cigarette. Looking it up, it ranged from 0.7 mg nicotine to 0.9 mg (available at nearly 100% to the smoker). Assuming half a pack, that's 7 to 9 mg per day in spikes.

Assuming he's going through 3 ml of 12 mg/ml liquid, that's 36 mg, with an availability of ten to thirty percent, or 3.6 mg to about 10 mg. Or, in range of what he was getting before, but slower and without as much of a spike.

[MorpheusPA]

I just tried the reasonably-new mini tank made for the Volt X2 (http://smokelessimage.com/accessories/v ... mizer.html). They fit the Volt beautifully (but won't fit anything else), hold 1.6 ml of liquid, and have perfect flavor and vapor (which can be an issue with the tanks).

So far I'm impressed.

[JohnVesey]

Hmm nice. Thanks for sharing